Question - Summoner What improvements would you like to see with summoner for kp2?

[aieches]

id want him get a buff to be able summon one of his bone posse, just in their flesh form so i can see wth they have bone mohawks..

 

[ienjoywinning]

I've always favored the zoning of Summoner over the pseudo-unblockables.
Bringing the no cooldown on bat back would make his zoning much better, but they'd have to give more recovery to Trance.
That way, he couldn't summon bats during Trance for insane damage and/or free 1 frame 50/50's.
There has to be some sort of give and take here...

Ive thought about nerfing his damage and making low bat hit mid and remove the cooldown , that seems pretty good to me.

 

[Nortnauq]

Ive thought about nerfing his damage and making low bat hit mid and remove the cooldown , that seems pretty good to me.

either that, or maybe just give the low bat more start up frames.
at this point, it would be more fun if they made no variation Quan play like MK9.

 

[WiseM0nkey]

Thats my point , you're risking the attempt of throwing out a poke that has small reach and is punishable and the reward is terrible compared to the punishment you get if it is blocked.

in the counterpoke game you probably wanna use d3 instead.

not many character can clean punish a -9 however, unless they're super ready for it and they use their 8f s1 to just frame punish. so the worst is you're giving up your turn.

 

[ienjoywinning]

in the counterpoke game you probably wanna use d3 instead.

not many character can clean punish a -9 however, unless they're super ready for it and they use their 8f s1 to just frame punish. so the worst is you're giving up your turn.

Giving away your turn could mean death since you're playing a character with no reversal

 

[MikeLovesSloths]

No

NO NO NO

Last time I checked, even if I took that away, kenshi doesn't have:
+14 launchers
A low and OH except kenjutsu which in kenjutsu he can't cancel into a +14 low launcher to make plus
6f d1
Mix ups for days
Kenshi doesn't have a backdash
1/2 screen reaching JIp
A flying bat w mix ups and free get out of jail make everything safe card
5f NJP w a hit box that's 3 miles wide and high and active for eternity
Hex spells granting 50% 1 bar combos on block
Armor spells
11F low reversal w armor launcher
A d3 that goes lower than most mids
A HKD throw that guarantees a rune check

Brb I'm about to vomit

Kenshi just needs a lot of crap but Quan is fine if you know the matchup. I believe the bat needs some serious adjustments and btw, the Hex 50% if only if you block the whole thing.

 

[MikeLovesSloths]

Quan needs to be able to summon an MK dragon for three bars that is an automatic round winner.

**Mic Drop**

He needs Dragon Cancels

 

[GAV]

 

[ienjoywinning]

@WiseM0nkey id also like to apologize for acting like a complete dick at first.

 

[WiseM0nkey]

Giving away your turn could mean death since you're playing a character with no reversal

apologies taken, dont worry

Im a little Ironic / sarcastic myself, but i like to keep things far from personal... so, thanks for the apologies

at the end of the day, it's all about the Quan here

 

[Deleted member 9158]

This is a serious topic right?

 

[MikeLovesSloths]

#FreeTheQuan

 

[Pig Of The Hut]

Kenshi just needs a lot of crap but Quan is fine if you know the matchup. I believe the bat needs some serious adjustments and btw, the Hex 50% if only if you block the whole thing.

Hex combo is guaranteed on block 50% is guaranteed

 

[Clampa_]

remove variation.

 

[MadeOfMetal]

Fair Quan Chi Nerfs:

(I swear I've posted these a dozen times)

Remove B2 pop-up.
Return autoblock after Skulls on hit.


(The above is how he's getting a lot of the ridiculous damage and unbreakable crap)


Increase the frames where an OH/Low hit from just a single frame, to 5 frames.

(Explanation: In MKX, if a low and an OH hit at the same time, one will be changed to mid. I propose that you take this property and extend it by 5 frames. All 1-frame blocks and pseudo-unblockables would be removed, Quan's mix ups would be easier to block, and he still keeps low bat. Fair. Balanced.)

These would address 90% of the Quan tearing.

CLAP,CLAP,CLAP.

that is reasonable, and it comes from a quan player

the damage, the pseudo's, and the pop up needs to go.. and that can al be taken away without ruining him.

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

yep i was wrong and i admitted it, i lacked knowledge and im not ashamed of it.... still it has nothing to do with my point, cause you have access to a low crouching poke wich is 6f and beats almost anything that's relatively minus, just because your only +3 it doesnt mean you dont have options nor it's still your opponents turn to do something, just like if im -3 after orbiting hat doesnt mean i have to give up my turn. Like i said, i can bdash to creat space and bait something, i can jump out, i can even go for a string if the opponent respects your d1 (like i have to pretty much respect his b3 after a d1 on hit),then if i see you maybe go for a bdash after my d1, i can still read a bdash and punish you... what's wrong with all of this?

if yo're just gonna say i dont understand the character and firing personal shots, then ok @ienjoywinning. still 112124xxexhat loops are not a thing

For sure, he has options. They just all favor the opponent

 

[thlityoursloat]

Give him Tanya's rekkas.

 

[haketh]

For sure, he has options. They just all favor the opponent

That makes absolutely no sense

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

That makes absolutely no sense

If you can't comprehend that then you should probably not participate in the discussion

 

[WiseM0nkey]

For sure, he has options. They just all favor the opponent

If you can't comprehend that then you should probably not participate in the discussion

stop,

you have the slight advantage, and the tools to make them hold something.... saying that being at +3 favours the opponent it's not exactly true

 

[Aramonde]

I knew Warlock & Sorcerer were gonna get nerfed if Summoner did (which summoner is the least affected). The only good thing to come of this is now these fucking cry babies can go cry about another character and i wont have to hear "OHMUHGERD QUAN IS BROKEN!!!!!!!!" constantly.

 

[STB Shujinkydink]

stop,

you have the slight advantage, and the tools to make them hold something.... saying that being at +3 favours the opponent it's not exactly true

It is man, all the characters quan needs it have the advantage.

Say I hit d1, here are my options.

Backdash. Not applicable in the corner, midscreen moves me towards the corner and costs me stamina.

B3,b2,f2. 6f poke or armour beats all options on hit. B3 does not connect at all ranges either.

Throw is his best option but there's always the possibility of being teched, which is pretty easy to read if quans in the corner.

Jump, get AA'd bro, especially offline. Not a horrible option to jump away, but they can just rush you down again easily lol.

So you see, he has options. I'm not saying he doesn't. But the likelyhood of catching the opponent is small if they know the properties of the poke

 

[God Confirm]

Quan play

It is man, all the characters quan needs it have the advantage.

Say I hit d1, here are my options.

Backdash. Not applicable in the corner, midscreen moves me towards the corner and costs me stamina.

B3,b2,f2. 6f poke or armour beats all options on hit. B3 does not connect at all ranges either.

Throw is his best option but there's always the possibility of being teched, which is pretty easy to read if quans in the corner.

Jump, get AA'd bro, especially offline. Not a horrible option to jump away, but they can just rush you down again easily lol.

So you see, he has options. I'm not saying he doesn't. But the likelyhood of catching the opponent is small if they know the properties of the poke

Characters with 6 frame pokes

Ermac
Scorp
Kotal
Goro
Shinnok
F/T

All are winning match ups for Quan to the point that even if he had no D1 he'd still be winning lol. You understand his defense is MEANT to be a hole in his game right, and that hole does not even come close to making up for his weakness at the moment? But regardless, I think we can rule out F/T, Ermac, and Goro as match ups where he is under high pressure, the speed of the poke makes no difference against Scorp pressure Shinnok ehhhhh maybe, Kotal is probably the only one.

Wasn't the reason for him getting a 6 frame poke solely to get out of LK pressure anyway? This DOES that, LK's fastest mid is 9f you have 12f to work with you are officially out


Also, your "facts" are just flat wrong. No, your opponent CANNOT AA an NjP you with any normal or anything other than armour, \which would be on a hard-read because it happens in like 7 frames flat. If your throws are easy to read and tech its YOUR fault especially if you are in the corner - you aren't meant to swap the freaking corner off this D1 lol the point of it is to get out of pressure, throw them fullscreen instead, if you want actual plus frames or a 50/50, you have to use his D3 which is 9f, +15 on hit and only -1 on block.

It's not meant to guarantee a 50/50 and it does it's role very well, I play a shitload of Quan before you call me some downplayer, you have to understand that your character has to have SOME limitations to make up for his relatively unlimited offense, this is one of them and it doesn't even come close to balancing out what he gets to make up for it.

 

[WiseM0nkey]

It is man, all the characters quan needs it have the advantage.

Say I hit d1, here are my options.

Backdash. Not applicable in the corner, midscreen moves me towards the corner and costs me stamina.

B3,b2,f2. 6f poke or armour beats all options on hit. B3 does not connect at all ranges either.

Throw is his best option but there's always the possibility of being teched, which is pretty easy to read if quans in the corner.

Jump, get AA'd bro, especially offline. Not a horrible option to jump away, but they can just rush you down again easily lol.

So you see, he has options. I'm not saying he doesn't. But the likelyhood of catching the opponent is small if they know the properties of the poke

that's why you have a d3.

what do you want? enough advantage to guarantee you a 50/50 MB rune situation by simply turning the tabels with an "easy to get out of pressure" 6f crouching poke?

 

[Phosferrax]

Please stop feeding the troll.