Qwark28
Joker waiting room
So, if you've seen my posts in this sub-section you know I spend 90% of my time playing Sun god.
This variation I think is pretty decent. I don't know exactly where he lies on the tier list but I think he's at minimum solid mid.
But there is a problem regarding how - he is and the holes he has. KK has a lot of holes in his strings and they are almost all very -. An opponent can very easily OS an armoured move and hit you as soon as there is a gap or you're - enough and you might say that there's no need to do these gimmicks so often.
You kind of have to. Let me put it in a situation like this. You have tempest Lao and he does an orbiting hat on block and he's -3. The mixup there is whether he will respect that -3 and block or poke, jump, backdash and armour.
If he pokes, B1 will beat him
If he jumps, B1 will anti air him and you can convert into a full combo
If he backdashes, B12 will catch him
If he armours, you will naturally lose
Seems pretty solid, right? But what if he does poke or does a standing attack? B1 will beat it.
And you will get nothing out of it. There is a huge commitment that KK has to take if he wants to punish people for not respecting frametraps. B1 by itself is not a punish for pressing buttons when every other character gets a full combo while your read on them pressing a button can be full combo punished in a situation where only armour should theoretically beat you. If you want to follow B1 up, everything is unsafe, if you do B122/4 and the opponent has blocked, you just killed yourself for trying to check your opponent with a meaningful punish over 4% of damage.
You could use 114, right? Except it's high, the range is horrible and it's currently bug to whiff the first 2 hits ( high, mid ) on pretty much half the cast. Not only that but its nature of being high leaves it meh. 212 is also a high starter and doesn't lead to more than 11% nor a tick throw setup so your opponent has nothing to fear from this grappler. F1 suffers from the same problem, it's also way too punishable if you go any further down the string tree.
War god doesn't have this problem because the overhead/low swords are fast enough to be true blockstrings off of B122 and safe vs 90% of the cast.
I don't know if you can change frame data specifically for variations but I would really like to see B12 made -4 in Sun god. You can't tick throw past that point, your followups if you don't hit confirm will be punishable gimmicks and a good player will be able to hit confirm B12 into air throw so as to at least get a combo for someone pressing buttons when they're -. I feel this is the fairest way to change this problem of his without asking for something ridiculous like F1B2 being safe.
Because right now, if you're - right next to kotal, he has to take major risks to capitalise on it, since B1 string series into X/Y specials are all punishable on block or armourable/pokeable on reaction, F1 series are all unsafe and 114 is high.
TLDR; Kotal can't check you on minor - frames because if you block he dies for trying to take advantage of + frames. If his complete gimmick of up close + frames issue is fixed I think this will be a very fair and balanced character. I REALLY hope this doesn't get viewed as "Oh well, you got buffed in the last patch, stop complaining" in regards to such a glaring flaw of this character.
Since this thread explains some KK issues, I'd like to point out a bug in which Kung lao is able to crouch block the Sun choke, having it whiff on certain distances that the rest of the cast would get hit by.
@Hidan
@UltraDavid
@KeyserSoze
@Mr Aqua
@Crayraven
@Shark Tank
@BigMilk
@SEV
@D. R.
This variation I think is pretty decent. I don't know exactly where he lies on the tier list but I think he's at minimum solid mid.
But there is a problem regarding how - he is and the holes he has. KK has a lot of holes in his strings and they are almost all very -. An opponent can very easily OS an armoured move and hit you as soon as there is a gap or you're - enough and you might say that there's no need to do these gimmicks so often.
You kind of have to. Let me put it in a situation like this. You have tempest Lao and he does an orbiting hat on block and he's -3. The mixup there is whether he will respect that -3 and block or poke, jump, backdash and armour.
If he pokes, B1 will beat him
If he jumps, B1 will anti air him and you can convert into a full combo
If he backdashes, B12 will catch him
If he armours, you will naturally lose
Seems pretty solid, right? But what if he does poke or does a standing attack? B1 will beat it.
And you will get nothing out of it. There is a huge commitment that KK has to take if he wants to punish people for not respecting frametraps. B1 by itself is not a punish for pressing buttons when every other character gets a full combo while your read on them pressing a button can be full combo punished in a situation where only armour should theoretically beat you. If you want to follow B1 up, everything is unsafe, if you do B122/4 and the opponent has blocked, you just killed yourself for trying to check your opponent with a meaningful punish over 4% of damage.
You could use 114, right? Except it's high, the range is horrible and it's currently bug to whiff the first 2 hits ( high, mid ) on pretty much half the cast. Not only that but its nature of being high leaves it meh. 212 is also a high starter and doesn't lead to more than 11% nor a tick throw setup so your opponent has nothing to fear from this grappler. F1 suffers from the same problem, it's also way too punishable if you go any further down the string tree.
War god doesn't have this problem because the overhead/low swords are fast enough to be true blockstrings off of B122 and safe vs 90% of the cast.
I don't know if you can change frame data specifically for variations but I would really like to see B12 made -4 in Sun god. You can't tick throw past that point, your followups if you don't hit confirm will be punishable gimmicks and a good player will be able to hit confirm B12 into air throw so as to at least get a combo for someone pressing buttons when they're -. I feel this is the fairest way to change this problem of his without asking for something ridiculous like F1B2 being safe.
Because right now, if you're - right next to kotal, he has to take major risks to capitalise on it, since B1 string series into X/Y specials are all punishable on block or armourable/pokeable on reaction, F1 series are all unsafe and 114 is high.
TLDR; Kotal can't check you on minor - frames because if you block he dies for trying to take advantage of + frames. If his complete gimmick of up close + frames issue is fixed I think this will be a very fair and balanced character. I REALLY hope this doesn't get viewed as "Oh well, you got buffed in the last patch, stop complaining" in regards to such a glaring flaw of this character.
Since this thread explains some KK issues, I'd like to point out a bug in which Kung lao is able to crouch block the Sun choke, having it whiff on certain distances that the rest of the cast would get hit by.
@Hidan
@UltraDavid
@KeyserSoze
@Mr Aqua
@Crayraven
@Shark Tank
@BigMilk
@SEV
@D. R.
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