Sonya - is she top 5 in your opinion?

[Shady]

Okay, I've been playing Sonya since about September. She actually just recently replaced Kabal as my main in January because of how much time and effort I put into this character. Before people start, let me say this straight, I do not think she is bad, I think she is good, she is definitely one of the better characters in this game, within the top 10 and is an absolute nightmare for a lot of players at high level.

However since I've been playing her I've been noticing some things, some match-ups, and a few other tidbits of the character that really lead me to believe that she is just outside the top 5 character category. I simply want to know what everyone else thinks she deserves when thinking about that and why?

P.S. The reason for this thread is mostly being that it's increasingly becoming a fad to put Sonya into top 5 like it was with some other characters before hand when back in September no one even knew who Sonya was for the most part and wouldn't even slide her into top ten....

 

[16 Bit]

List her bad match ups.

 

[Z-911-Z]

No.

 

[PND OmegaK]

Easily top 3 IMO, thats from playing the foxmeister though.

 

[salvificblood]

She is easily top 5. She walks into it.

 

[RampaginDragon]

I have fought few good Sonya's, but when you fight one that is truly good with Sonya you know you're in for a tough fight. In my opinion Sonya is one of the most scarcely used fighters in the game. Though recently more and more people are picking her up. She has tons of mix up options, reset options and so many tricks up her sleeve.

The best Sonya I've ever fought has to be one of the clan members from TOL or TOA, TAO or whatever the fuck the clan name is. But he was a monster with Sonya.

The only good Sonya's I’ve fought are the said clan member, Foxy, and REO. And I've fought there Sonya's very little.

So since I haven’t had a great deal of experience I can't say for sure whether or not I’d put her in top 5. But I know for sure she’s close.

All I know is, fuck arch kick, fuck Sonya's fireball.

 

[Shady]

List her bad match ups.

Okay, this is IMO because I do not have the benefit to play against pro players every week and admittedly I will always maintain that I'm average at the game, so I will agree these might be off or incorrect and anyone is more welcome to correct me.

Also, before more people start calling me stupid. I am not denying the possibility she might be top 5, I am saying that for reasons stated above I JUST DON'T SEE IT PERSONALLY. I am more than open for someone to change my mind, maybe even show me something with the character I completely overlooked...

Anyways, Bad MUs:

Kabal (4-6, maybe even 7-3): I'm pretty sure this one is self explanatory. Any match up from here on I expect a lot of disagreement.

Sub Zero (4-6): Sub can control the screen against Sonya. I agree rings can check him, but it is a nightmare to rush down. Yes, EX Cartwheel, but it burns meter and you have to get it in perfectly. It's not an unwinnable match-up, and she certainly will give Sub a hand full, but off the onset, I think he's in a better place.

Freddy (4-6): I don't believe that Freddy is top 5 or even top 10 atm like a lot of people are starting to but I think what he has in terms of Nightmare stance and his zoning game makes it difficult for Sonya

Noob (4-6, might be 5-5, I'm definitely going to seek out Noob players at WB to test this one out): Say what you say about Sonya being a nightmare up close that doesn't take away the fact that she still always needs to get in. Saying stuff like "Oh, if she can get in on you you're fucked" is like saying "if he can keep you out and you can't get in you're fucked", it's not definitive, it depends on which player can force his playstyle. Noob has a lot of things too keep Sonya at bay that gives him the edge in this IMO

KL (4-6): For the sole reason that the spin blows up a few things that she has.

Everyone else is either 5-5 or 6-4 for Sonya IMO. If I was to slide any other character into 4-6 category, it would probably be Kitana or Liu Kang even though I don't believe Kitana to be top 5 anymore either.

 

[Briggs8417]

She is easily top 5, Omega is right she is easily top three, I honestly think the top 5 characters aren't what most people think they are.

 

[xenogorgeous]

yep, Sonya is no joke, she has a lot of special moves, and plus, that military stance with lots of options .... she can keep an annoying pressure while advancing.

 

[16 Bit]

You basically just made the case for her being top 5 with that short list. A couple of them like Sub will be disputed too.

 

[LEGEND]

imo, there are somewhere around 12 characters i consider to have top 5 potential. Sonya is one of them

though i do not put her in MY personal top 5 list

 

[salvificblood]

Okay, this is IMO because I do not have the benefit to play against pro players every week and admittedly I will always maintain that I'm average at the game, so I will agree these might be off or incorrect and anyone is more welcome to correct me.

Also, before more people start calling me stupid. I am not denying the possibility she might be top 5, I am saying that for reasons stated above I JUST DON'T SEE IT PERSONALLY. I am more than open for someone to change my mind, maybe even show me something with the character I completely overlooked...

Anyways, Bad MUs:

Kabal (4-6, maybe even 7-3): I'm pretty sure this one is self explanatory. Any match up from here on I expect a lot of disagreement.

Sub Zero (4-6): Sub can control the screen against Sonya. I agree rings can check him, but it is a nightmare to rush down. Yes, EX Cartwheel, but it burns meter and you have to get it in perfectly. It's not an unwinnable match-up, and she certainly will give Sub a hand full, but off the onset, I think he's in a better place.

Freddy (4-6): I don't believe that Freddy is top 5 or even top 10 atm like a lot of people are starting to but I think what he has in terms of Nightmare stance and his zoning game makes it difficult for Sonya

Noob (4-6, might be 5-5, I'm definitely going to seek out Noob players at WB to test this one out): Say what you say about Sonya being a nightmare up close that doesn't take away the fact that she still always needs to get in. Saying stuff like "Oh, if she can get in on you you're fucked" is like saying "if he can keep you out and you can't get in you're fucked", it's not definitive, it depends on which player can force his playstyle. Noob has a lot of things too keep Sonya at bay that gives him the edge in this IMO

KL (4-6): For the sole reason that the spin blows up a few things that she has.

Everyone else is either 5-5 or 6-4 for Sonya IMO. If I was to slide any other character into 4-6 category, it would probably be Kitana or Liu Kang even though I don't believe Kitana to be top 5 anymore either.

Sub-Zero doesn't beat Sonya. I think that matchup is probably 5-5. Also, I don't think Noob beats Sonya either, I think that's another 5-5. The problem for Noob is that he can't really do anything once Sonya gets in. He can keep her out but once she's in there, she's in there.

Don't know about the others but if those are two of her worst matchups, then you know Sonya has it really good...

 

[THTB]

I think she's really high up, but it's hard to say because there are too many characters that are seriously good. Personally, she doesn't beat enough characters hard enough to be top 3.

 

[Shady]

You basically just made the case for her being top 5 with that short list. A couple of them like Sub will be disputed too.

Yeah, but there are at least about 5-6 more characters in the game with as little bad match-ups as I think Sonya does. 5-7 IMO there are characters with like 2-3...... there are some with pretty much none (Looking at you Kabal)..... I just want to hear your opinion behind it tbh, because maybe I'm missing something. This is fairly educational for me when it comes to my own character, the main reason I started this thread.

Also, as a Kitana player, what about Sonya unnerves you so much? At full screen it pretty much becomes a 6-4 for you until Sonya gets in IMO after playing NeoRussel's Kitana for like 2 hours.

 

[16 Bit]

Don't know about the others but if those are two of her worst matchups, then you know Sonya has it really good...

Seriously. If Sonya is not then who is and how many bad MU do you think they have?

 

[Z-911-Z]

imo, there are somewhere around 12 characters i consider to have top 5 potential. Sonya is one of them

though i do not put her in MY personal top 5 list

I pretty much agree, honestly I think the more players can get matchup experience against her the less she'll be thought of as top five. She's good and doesn't get blown up by anyone in a 3-7 match(Sans Kabal), but I think people are just blowing her out of proportion since she's underplayed compared to top tier threats.

 

[LEGEND]

^ Scorpion, Sektor, Raiden, Mileena, Kabal

all have zero "Bad" MUs if you want to make that argument Bit

 

[16 Bit]

^ Scorpion, Sektor, Raiden, Mileena, Kabal

all have zero "Bad" MUs if you want to make that argument Bit

Scorpion having no bad MU is ridiculous. Where did that meme come from?

 

[Shady]

The problem for Noob is that he can't really do anything once Sonya gets in. He can keep her out but once she's in there, she's in there.

I didn't argue that Sonya is not really good. Also, the thing about saying that about the zoning match-ups, it becomes very situation doesn't it? What if the Noob player CAN keep her out the whole game making the whole reads. As a whole, the style of Noob's character I think he scrapes by just into her 4-6 territory, but like I said, might be 5-5.

Osu 16 Bit

Characters with fewer bad match-ups than I think Sonya has?

Kabal
Raiden
Mileena
Kung Lao (Sue me, I still believe he is good)
Jax

Character with equal or same bad MUs that I still think above Sonya?

Smoke

Also, I forgot, I'd say Kenshi is potentially Sonya's 4-6.....

 

[16 Bit]

Also, as a Kitana player, what about Sonya unnerves you so much? At full screen it pretty much becomes a 6-4 for you until Sonya gets in IMO after playing NeoRussel's Kitana for like 2 hours.

Because Sonya is probably getting in eventually and she has good answers for Kitana's footsies. At full screen Kitana doesn't win, she just runs away.

 

[RomeoBravoDelta]

^ Scorpion, Sektor, Raiden, Mileena, Kabal

all have zero "Bad" MUs if you want to make that argument Bit

Sektor has bad matchups.

 

[LEGEND]

i honestly don't believe that there are any seriously problematic MUs for scorpion

and with his high ability to punish and use of health advantage he is a major force

 

[GNG Iniquity]

Sub Zero (4-6): Sub can control the screen against Sonya. I agree rings can check him, but it is a nightmare to rush down. Yes, EX Cartwheel, but it burns meter and you have to get it in perfectly. It's not an unwinnable match-up, and she certainly will give Sub a hand full, but off the onset, I think he's in a better place.

No way, this is a 6-4 in Sonya's favor. It's a 4-6 for Cage because Cage has no tools to stop SZ's clones/ice balls. This is why Cage has to turtle that MU. Sonya does and if Sub wants to sit behind a clone, it's a stupid move if Sonya has meter for EX cartwheel. Hell, Sonya can just send ring after ring, build meter and wait for SZ to approach her in which she can blow an EX cartwheel and put him in a terrible position with the standing reset and start her pressure and MS.

People are too fixated on Sonya's dive kick. They shut it down, so what? She's got plenty of other great tools. It's great if she can use it, but it isn't that game changing.

 

[16 Bit]

I didn't argue that Sonya is not really good. Also, the thing about saying that about the zoning match-ups, it becomes very situation doesn't it? What if the Noob player CAN keep her out the whole game making the whole reads. As a whole, the style of Noob's character I think he scrapes by just into her 4-6 territory, but like I said, might be 5-5.

Osu 16 Bit

Characters with fewer bad match-ups than I think Sonya has?

Kabal
Raiden
Mileena
Kung Lao (Sue me, I still believe he is good)
Jax

Character with equal or same bad MUs that I still think above Sonya?

Smoke

Also, I forgot, I'd say Kenshi is potentially Sonya's 4-6.....

Everyone that plays those characters are also trying to make the case that they have 4-5 bad MU so they're not top 5. Who knows?

 

[Shady]

Everyone that plays those characters are also trying to make the case that they have 4-5 bad MU so they're not top 5. Who knows?

On an unrelated note, if anyone thinks Kabal has 4-5 bad MUs is a fooooooool. .