Strategy - Master of Storms Master of Storms - Wonders

[SirRaven]

How's the damage if you finish with b1,1,1+3 after electrocute instead of b1,4 and burning an extra meter on rising fly to pop him back up for a grab?

Might find that it isn't much of a damage difference and you save a bar of meter...that is if that string is available in MOS, I think it's variation-neutral.

 

[mrtom]

Does anyone have any damaging follow-ups for when the orb trap hits? I've been playing around with MoS in matches and have gotten pretty good at controlling the space with orbs but whenever I catch someone in a trap I can't get enough damage out of it.

 

[Predannok]

things the orbs could use:
4. You should be able to control when to connect the orbs. This really bothers me

doesn't vincinity blast connect orbs?

 

[Barrogh]

doesn't vincinity blast connect orbs?

Probably not. Even then, by the time you've done VB they would connect themselves lol.

 

[The PantyChrist]

Nothing huge but f2,2+4 is a special cancellable hkd that can be used mid screen. This is the one that has piqued my interest the most.

But I like set up characters. I'm also thinking of using hat trick Lao and duailist Liu.

 

[brizzle]

Probably not. Even then, by the time you've done VB they would connect themselves lol.

if you could manually control the beam I would pick up MOS instantly. You get two orbs out and the opponent would be afraid to do anything lol. It'd be so much fun. Oh well back to Thunder God

 

[Lmiller2010]

Nothing huge but f2,2+4 is a special cancellable hkd that can be used mid screen. This is the one that has piqued my interest the most.

But I like set up characters. I'm also thinking of using hat trick Lao and duailist Liu.

I've been playing around with f2, 2+4 as well. Great range and plenty of time to throw out an orb on knockdown. I also use 1,1, 2 to throw out an orb on knockdown.

 

[Apex Kano]

TG = top tier. Displacer = Mid. Mos = shit

You must not be good with set up kharacters then. MOS is very good choice for me since that's my style. Zoning and set ups.

 

[brizzle]

You must not be good with set up kharacters then. MOS is very good choice for me since that's my style. Zoning and set ups.

List the setups

 

[Apex Kano]

List the setups

Use your imagination. The Spark balls can be used to make your block strings safe. You can use it to catch jumpers or time it right to extend combos. You can throw one behind you then start rushing the opponent then catch them off guard when you throw you second spark. Just have to be creative.

 

[mrtom]

Use your imagination. The Spark balls can be used to make your block strings safe. You can use it to catch jumpers or time it right to extend combos. You can throw one behind you then start rushing the opponent then catch them off guard when you throw you second spark. Just have to be creative.

Agreed. I don't think MoS is a style that has setups in the traditional sense, it's more like one giant mixup. As long as you've got one orb out you're opponent has no clue when the second one is coming and if they block the beam then they need to guess if you'll go low, high or throw. If you cancel a block string into orb 2 and your opponent tried to punish they get caught. When using MoS, I always think the match is much closer than it really is because I've taken a bunch of hits but when I look at my life bar it turns out I've got a massive life lead. Every hit I took would normally result in 25-30% combo damage but the beam interrupts them so only the first attack lands and stuns them long enough for me to land a combo. MoS feels so weak compared to TG but it's definitely not, just requires a different play style.

 

[learis1]

So whats your guys go-to combos when you get them caught in the orb's electricity?

 

[mrtom]

So whats your guys go-to combos when you get them caught in the orb's electricity?

Usually I'll do 34,bf3 to put them in the corner and save my meter until I get them there. If I feel like spending meter I'll do 34,ex shocker, b1,1,1+3 or b1,4,bf3 or whatever juggle you're used to. I know there are more damaging combos but I don't fully trust myself to land then online. It also doesn't help that I'm so used to TG strings so I'll forget I can't charge the lightning.

 

[brizzle]

Use your imagination. The Spark balls can be used to make your block strings safe. You can use it to catch jumpers or time it right to extend combos. You can throw one behind you then start rushing the opponent then catch them off guard when you throw you second spark. Just have to be creative.

1. Canceling a block string into a single orb is not safe. It's highly punishable
2. You can not see an opponent jump and throw out a second orb to anti air. You would have two preemptively connect and hope they jump into it.
3. if anybody lets you throw out an orb then run up and throw another, then they'll lose to anything. That's not a setup
4. Run cancel in TG and ex teleport in Displacer are much better combo extenders than orbs.

 

[mrtom]

1. Canceling a block string into a single orb is not safe. It's highly punishable
2. You can not see an opponent jump and throw out a second orb to anti air. You would have two preemptively connect and hope they jump into it.
3. if anybody lets you throw out an orb then run up and throw another, then they'll lose to anything. That's not a setup
4. Run cancel in TG is a much better combo extender than orbs

I haven't been punished for canceling into a ball. A lot of opponents have tried and I do get hit but the ball is out and interrupts them before they can do any real damage and they stay stunned long enough for me to do more damage than I received. You definitely would get hurt canceling if you don't have another orb already out though, it's gotta be canceled into the 2nd orb.

It is very hard to throw one out as an AA but if you anticipate it just throw it, if they don't jump then nothing lost and you can use the time to get another ball on screen. This is too risky vs characters with good projectiles since they can punish your attempt to throw another ball.

You can bait them into jumping by throwing a fireball first then throwing the second orb. The animation looks very similar so they might think you're throwing a second fireball.

 

[Apex Kano]

Maybe a video will explain it better. But I mainly throw one out, attack and then throw another to caught them off guard. Usually people forget you've thrown one out.

 

[mrtom]

I found I nice little trap setup if you've got 1 orb already out:

34, f2-2+4, df2

This will only work if the opponent is grounded at the start and they end up landing right on top of the second orb so they're forced to block.

 

[Cosmic Forge]

I found I nice little trap setup if you've got 1 orb already out:

34, f2-2+4, df2

This will only work if the opponent is grounded when at the start and they end up landing right on top of the second orb so they're forced to block.

That's a good setup.

I'm still trying to find ways to make MOS a threat in the corner.

I've found some weird stuff using Vicinity Blast though... like:

[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, VB (hold until they land on it) throw (puts them back in the corner) -- 29%

Chaining a normal trap into an EX trap:
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), JIK, air b,f+3 -- 30%
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), 3,4, d,f+2 -- 31%
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), JIK, b+1,1,1+3 -- 32%
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), JIK, 2,1,4, d,f+2 -- 33%
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), JIK, b+1,4,d,f+2 -- 37%(Best I can find so far)
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), VB(hold until hit confirm)~run cancel, 2,1,4,d,f+2 -- 32%

Basically I'm trying to find a use for VB run cancel, but the recovery is nowhere near as good as TG LB run cancels. :/

"Useless Tech"

 

[mrtom]

That's a good setup.

I'm still trying to find ways to make MOS a threat in the corner.

I've found some weird stuff using Vicinity Blast though... like:

[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, VB (hold until they land on it) throw (puts them back in the corner) -- 29%

Chaining a normal trap into an EX trap:
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), JIK, air b,f+3 -- 30%
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), 3,4, d,f+2 -- 31%
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), JIK, b+1,1,1+3 -- 32%
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), JIK, 2,1,4, d,f+2 -- 33%
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), JIK, b+1,4,d,f+2 -- 37%(Best I can find so far)
[Corner] Back trap, up trap, NJP, uppercut, EX trap, (back away from corner), VB(hold until hit confirm)~run cancel, 2,1,4,d,f+2 -- 32%

Basically I'm trying to find a use for VB run cancel, but the recovery is nowhere near as good as TG LB run cancels. :/

"Useless Tech"

I haven't really played with high orbs except to keep an opponent from jumping at me. air traps into VB never occurred to me, interesting idea.

Not sure if you saw these in the other thread but I found a couple useful ex orb combo enders:

Corner orb setups:
NJP, B2, 214, (EX)DB2 (26%)
34, B14, (EX)DF3, 214, (EX)DF2 (34%)

These work on someone caught in the beam so the first hit is the orbs but they would probably work alone as well. A 214 juggle ender into ex orb seems very handy since it doesn't push them out of beam range.

 

[Slayhawk84]

My mid screen BnB after catching them in the trap is to run up and do 213, bf3. Its only 21% but its reliable. If I'm too far away I just uppercut for 18%.

 

[mrtom]

My mid screen BnB after catching them in the trap is to run up and do 213, bf3. Its only 21% but its reliable. If I'm too far away I just uppercut for 18%.

I've been trying to figure out how to get respectable damage when an orb trap connects and here is what I've come up with so far. I couldn't really break 34% midscreen using one meter, hopefully someone will come up with something better that's practical online.

Orb Trap Punishes:
Midscreen:
34, BF3(21%)
NJP, 34, BF3 (24%)
B14, (EX)DF2, B14, BF3 (33%)
34, (EX)DF2, B11 1+3 (34%)

Corner:
NJP, B2, 214, DF2 (31%)
34, B14, (EX)DF3, B11 1+3 (38%)
NJP, B2, 214, (EX)DF2, B11 1+3 (40%)

Corner EX Orb Setups:
NJP, B2, 214, (EX)DB2 (26%)
34, B14, (EX)DF3, 214, (EX)DF2 (34%)

 

[wsj515]

I've been trying to figure out how to get respectable damage when an orb trap connects and here is what I've come up with so far. I couldn't really break 34% midscreen using one meter, hopefully someone will come up with something better that's practical online.

Orb Trap Punishes:
Midscreen:
34, BF3(21%)
NJP, 34, BF3 (24%)
B14, (EX)DF2, B14, BF3 (33%)
34, (EX)DF2, B11 1+3 (34%)

Corner:
NJP, B2, 214, DF2 (31%)
34, B14, (EX)DF3, B11 1+3 (38%)
NJP, B2, 214, (EX)DF2, B11 1+3 (40%)

Corner EX Orb Setups:
NJP, B2, 214, (EX)DB2 (26%)
34, B14, (EX)DF3, 214, (EX)DF2 (34%)

My orb trap punish midscreen is NJP, b14xxdf2ex, b14xxdb1, db/df4. I think it does more than 34%, but I don't remember exactly. You can do the same combo without the NJP, but you should always do it if you have the time to. I like ending with b14xxdb1 midscreen because it puts them just outside neutral range, nets good damage, and gives you ample time to set up another orb. you could end with superman for corner carry however. I have some corner stuff but I need to see if I can optimize it further before posting it, you can definitely get over 40% and end in an orb setup with 1 bar though.

 

[mrtom]

My orb trap punish midscreen is NJP, b14xxdf2ex, b14xxdb1, db/df4. I think it does more than 34%, but I don't remember exactly. You can do the same combo without the NJP, but you should always do it if you have the time to. I like ending with b14xxdb1 midscreen because it puts them just outside neutral range, nets good damage, and gives you ample time to set up another orb. you could end with superman for corner carry however. I have some corner stuff but I need to see if I can optimize it further before posting it, you can definitely get over 40% and end in an orb setup with 1 bar though.

What I find strange is that these 2 combos do 34% off the orbs:
34, (EX)DF2, 11-1+3
34,(EX)DF2,B14,BF3
I added njp before both and it still does 34%

I'm not sure when damage scaling kicks in but the beam does 6 hits so I'm guessing that has something to do with it. I prefer to use 34 instead of B14 for the first part since it does more damage(B14- 8%, 34- 10%)

I tried your punish- NJP,B14(EX)DF2,B14,DB1,orb and it does 33% with the njp and 32% without it. I do like the distance it leaves you and you might be able to cancel the lightning and continue the combo.

On another note, I've found F1,4 can be your best friend. 5 frame startup ending in sweep giving you a free orb. I also noticed in the frame data that the above & in front/behind traps have 40 frames of recovery vs the ground orbs which have 49 frames. Not sure if that will really change much as I rarely use air orbs but it might allow for other uses.

 

[Barrogh]

...and you might be able to cancel the lightning and continue the combo.

That only works in TG.

On another note, I've found F1,4 can be your best friend. 5 frame startup ending in sweep giving you a free orb. I also noticed in the frame data that the above & in front/behind traps have 40 frames of recovery vs the ground orbs which have 49 frames. Not sure if that will really change much as I rarely use air orbs but it might allow for other uses.

Data is bollocks. For example, no way there's no startup on that and no way it's different on different stamina-consuming teleports, for example (yes, that's not MoS, but as I've said, that's just an example). That, of NRS has funny idea on what startup is.

My usual negativity is under the spoiler below.

Spoiler

Additional note: f14 strategy you're describing is exactly the grudge I'm having with Raiden variations. So, MoS can do 9% off fast punish and setup orb in an attempt to get something bigger. TG, however, gets full combo off that guaranteed without the need of any of those puny setups that may or may not work. Pretty much the same damage meterless too while you need a much harder to get bar to get comparable damage.
Not to mention that he gets more chip/meter on blocked f1 and is safer. You, on the other hand, only get your face rearranged for your trouble (what's with -11 with no pushback).

Inb4 NRS steps in and normalizes TG to the level of the rest variations while not making them much more practical (which may be good or bad depending on what happens to the rest of the cast)

 

[GamerBlake90]

I've gotten to attached to TG. I fee so naked without my lighting strings.

Whereas I feel naked without my teleport. In the neutral, I walk back A LOT and this ends up putting me in the corner quickly. Displacer solves that problem down to a T.