Community Vote: 3/5 Matches or Current Ruling?

[Jolt]

I am very much in favor of 3/5 straight through. It could start after pools, but I feel like starting 3/5 at certain points leads to confusion for some people because one tournament might do top 32, one top 16, one top 8, etc.

With the variation system, 3/5 gives our game a chance to really shape up IMO. First to 2, I'm usually a little worried to switch but I'm more willing to make adjustments with 3/5 as I have that second game to become CERTAIN that a switch is in my best interest.

I think it would give certain players an extra shot at success and possibly even shake up the consistent placings

I also wouldn't be against 60 second rounds, I feel like it's plenty of time in this game assuming there are no major system mechanic changes.

 

[BunLantern]

I rely solely on gimmicks to win, which in 2/3 can actually work. 3/5 is going to reward the better player and the better character. Think of all the Goros and Jasons you'll be hurting with this!

 

[SylverRye]

Yes please make them 3/5. Ffs you cant even run a secondary character because if you fuck up, you only get one more shot with your main lol. Matches wont even be that much longer, this game moves by so fast. As it is right now, it is way to easy to he randomed out. So people would not beat the people they beat if there was that extra match imo. I vote yes 100%

 

[GamerBlake90]

I voted for 3/5.

Yes, I'm aware of concerns over time constraints, but if we could make it work with Injustice I don't see why it can't work with MKX. Two different games, yes, doesn't invalidate the possibility.

 

[SylverRye]

Also, imo there should be a rule that if a button check lasts a certain amount of time, you have to run that as an actual match. Its ridiculous how long some of these are.. checking combos, stance switching and even teabagging. If it can't be 3/5 all through than i agree with pig. Top 32 and up should be 3/5 at the very least.

 

[aieches]

3/5 - start to finish..

more time to actually make better adjustments.

think of kung lao - say you have a set vs PL - then right after you face foxy - two completely different play styles of the same variation.. 3/5 would give you way better chance to make adaptations to not only the character but the player faced as well.
Same thing if one minute you play Forever Kings, tempest then the next you have to Face scars Hat trick.

times this my multiple players- characters - and variations - think i bit more rounds to make adjustments would be a good thing

in this game where you can lose neutral so fast and then get cornered into ggs - 3/5 is necessary.

another reason while i would vote for not just top 32 is because NORMALLY- top 32 is a lot of similar faces. going with 3/5 , you give the lesser known players more chances to level up seeing how they would get more matches with high level players from across the scene and not just whos goes to their locals. yes , losing is losing, and nobody wanted to lose, but Losing 3/5 to Slayers Kungjin is still a better learning experience than losing 2/3 it gives them more chances to play which - hones their skills- they learn more- and have better bang for their buck of the $ used to enter a tourney. - yes theres always ppl playing in hotel rooms and what not but like everyone says " its different being in the moment at a tourney.

Spoiler: plus

i just wanna see more matches
more matches = maybeee more longevity

 

[Tony at Home]

Out of curiosity, how many cases are there when after properly setting your buttons in the menu, did button checks show something went wrong?

And I'm not talking about just jumping into the game and seeing someone set them differently- I mean strictly, having entered all your inputs in settings, have they ever not worked?

I do recall there was some oddity in Injustice with it.

 

[Tony at Home]

Yes please make them 3/5. Ffs you cant even run a secondary character because if you fuck up, you only get one more shot with your main lol.

This.

I think best of 2 completely kills the variation aspect of this game.

 

[G4S Claude VonStroke]

Realistically with the restart button, and pace of the game 3/5 in mkX probably takes a similar amount of time to 2/3 MK9.

Changing timer to 60 seconds and having 3/5 would make a lot of sense universally.

 

[Tony at Home]

The game doesn't necessarily need a shorter timer. It's unique to each fighting game what the desired win conditions should be.

Not having timeouts is generally comparable to not having ring outs like Soul Calibur does.

Or saying Smash needs lifebar-depletion in addition to knocking off stage

If the game decides that's not a way it wants players to win by then it's perfectly legitimate to pretty much restrict winning to lifebar depletion.

 

[NickDaGreek1983]

Single match knock outs should be fine.
No 3/5 crap.
The less MKX the world sees, the better. . .

 

[buyacushun]

I'd like to see 3/5 at least after pools. Can all the TOs please make this a tourney wide rule too? I'd also like to see a lower timer. How quick games happen it probably wouldn't matter but I think it could help the more defensive characters/players (Blood God Kotal, FA Jacqui, Kitana. Any players who are naturally more defensive).


I find it funny that the community talked about rule changes because of how quick games went and nothing came about it. Can the top community members please really push for the change they want? At least this time the thread was made by a respected TO.

The game doesn't necessarily need a shorter timer. It's unique to each fighting game what the desired win conditions should be.

Not having timeouts is generally comparable to not having ring outs like Soul Calibur does.

Or saying Smash needs lifebar-depletion in addition to knocking off stage

If the game decides that's not a way it wants players to win by then it's perfectly legitimate to pretty much restrict winning to lifebar depletion.

The thing is the game still has the possibility of a time out win happening. It's just the game is so offense based it barely if ever happens. It's not completely changing up the rules and feel to a game. This is more like deciding if a character is too powerful imo.

 

[Jolt]

The game doesn't necessarily need a shorter timer. It's unique to each fighting game what the desired win conditions should be.

Not having timeouts is generally comparable to not having ring outs like Soul Calibur does.

Or saying Smash needs lifebar-depletion in addition to knocking off stage

If the game decides that's not a way it wants players to win by then it's perfectly legitimate to pretty much restrict winning to lifebar depletion.

I don't think anyone is considering it necessary, I think everyone who is saying 60 second rounds are saying that it's a compromise that we would be willing to make if time constraints are the main concern for 3/5. Even with the timer being 60 seconds, how many rounds ended by time out do you think we would see?

Mobility in this game is pretty ridiculous (I personally think ridiculous in a good way). Offense is crazy powerful, rounds generally last 45 seconds tops as is.

It seems as though lowering the timer would be negligible while ensuring to TOs that the 3/5 sets could still be manageable time wise.

 

[Jolt]

Spoiler: IGNORE THIS

Sorry to double post, but I also wanted to present some math based off of what @Mikemetroid posted earlier to help illustrate the 3/5 argument for a few people who can't be bothered to think about it/do it themselves because the POTENTIAL time difference is surprisingly large:

I calculate time to the absolute max of what it could be.

90 seconds x 3 = max time a match can be. that times 5 matches + time to allocate for button check, signing up.

For MKX as is (2/3)

90 seconds x 3 = 270 seconds per match
270 seconds x 3 = 810 seconds per set
810/60 = 13.5 minutes per set
+ button check, controller desync, signup, etc. I won't claim to know how long any of that takes

For MKX 3/5:

90 seconds x 3 = 270 seconds per match
270 seconds x 5 = 1350 seconds per set
1350/60 = 22.5 minutes per set
+ button check, etc.

For MKX 3/5 60 Second rounds
60 seconds x 3 = 180 seconds per match
180 seconds x 5 = 900 seconds per set
900/60 = 15 minutes per set
+ button check, etc.


These are obviously MAXIMUM numbers, assuming that 5 games are played and every round ends in a time out. But looking at that, the difference between 2/3 and 3/5 has the potential to be HUGE, because that is for every single set. Dropping the timer makes the difference pretty much negligible IMO. An extra 1.5 minutes isn't going to kill anyone when almost 0 sets will reach the extreme. Adding 10 potential minutes per set might though.

In first to 2, you'll get more absolute mops than you will in first to 3. I think it's fair to expect a good number of sets to go at least 3-1

Ignore all of this because the math is inaccurate lol. Gonna go back and fix it to the best of my abilities though in a new post. What's up with this non-standard timer? Thanks to @16 Bit for pointing this out to my oblivious ass

 

[16 Bit]

MKX timer isn't actual seconds so all this math is inaccurate.

 

[Jolt]

MKX timer isn't actual seconds so all this math is inaccurate.

lol really? I never even noticed that now I just went and wasted time. That math was hard for me too

EDIT: Ayyyy, I got you. From a quick Google search, I discovered that 90 timer = 150 seconds per round? Now I gotta remath

So one tick on the MKX timer is about 1.66 seconds unless someone corrects me with a more specific number, I'll math based on that now

 

[HoneyBee]

I would prefer 3/5 100% because of many of the reasons already listed.

For those discussing the timer, I should note that my local has been using 60 seconds (which in reality is 1 min 40 seconds) rounds for the past 5 months (maybe longer) and not once has there ever been a timeout even with the shorter clock. TO's that are worried about matches running out of time need to realize that this is not an issue.

At NEC, I believe pools 1 and 2 were both done in less than an hour. If there wasn't a multitude of issues with the stream/running brackets, the whole tournament would have been over well ahead of schedule. And preventing a game from being 3/5 and leaving it as 2/3 for the purpose of giving bracket runners/streamers the ability to fuck up and still have time isn't fair to the players.

 

[haketh]

This.

I think best of 2 completely kills the variation aspect of this game.

How? It didn't in Melty or Arcana

 

[Jolt]

I FIXED MY FREAKING MATH SO YOU ARE GOING TO TAKE THIS POST AND ACCEPT IT, KTHNX TYM

I also wanted to present some math based off of what @Mikemetroid posted earlier to help illustrate the 3/5 argument for a few people who can't be bothered to think about it/do it themselves because the POTENTIAL time difference is surprisingly large:

I calculate time to the absolute max of what it could be.

90 seconds x 3 = max time a match can be. that times 5 matches + time to allocate for button check, signing up.

As it turns out, the MKX timer isn't in actual seconds and anyone that actually pays attention to the clock can tell you this. I am not one of those people. I just play my game and think seconds are waaaaayyyy longer than they actually are. Now. On with the numbers.

90 timer in MKX = 150 seconds
150 seconds = 2 minutes and 30 seconds

60 timer in MKX = 100 seconds
100 seconds = 1 minute and 40 seconds

For MKX as is (2/3)

150 seconds x 3 = 450 seconds per match
450 seconds x 3 = 1350 seconds per set
1350/60 = 22.5 minutes per set
+ button check, controller desync, signup, etc. I won't claim to know how long any of that takes

For MKX 3/5:

150 seconds x 3 = 450 seconds per match
450 seconds x 5 = 2250 seconds per set
2250/60 = 37.5 minutes per set
+ button check, etc.

For MKX 3/5 60 timer rounds
100 seconds x 3 = 300 seconds per match
300 seconds x 5 = 1500 seconds per set
1500/60 = 25 minutes per set
+ button check, etc.


These are obviously MAXIMUM numbers, assuming that 5 games are played and every round ends in a time out. But looking at that, the difference between 2/3 and 3/5 has the potential to be HUGE, because that is for every single set. Dropping the timer makes the difference pretty much negligible IMO.

In first to 2, you'll get more absolute mops than you will in first to 3. I think it's fair to expect a good number of sets to go at least 3-1

As Honeybee pointed out above me, his local has been using 60 second timer with no adverse effects. The difference between 2/3 sets and 3/5 sets and 60 timer seems to be about 2.5 minutes MAX. Whereas the difference between 2/3 sets 90 timer and 3/5 90 timer is about 15 minutes max.

If a lower timer isn't causing any additional time outs, I say why not? A minute and 40 seconds per round in this game is definitely enough with the current meta.

I can't believe we were getting 2 and a half minutes per round as is. That's crazy.

 

[Mikemetroid]

MKX timer isn't actual seconds so all this math is inaccurate.

Why is it not actual seconds lol

 

[Jolt]

Why is it not actual seconds lol

RIGHT?! That's so stupid. I feel so ashamed for never noticing. Totally explains why really close first to 5s take soooooooooo long though. Glad I'm not alone in my lack of timer observation

 

[SneakyTortoise]

I find it amazing and absurd that 3/5 has not already become the standard for this game, especially as towards the end of injustice it was pretty much universally agreed that that game should be 100% 3/5.
And if you say "different game blah blah blah" yes, it is a different game, which is objectively played at a faster pace. How is this even a question?

 

[HoneyBee]

I find it amazing and absurd that 3/5 has not already become the standard for this game, especially as towards the end of injustice it was pretty much universally agreed that that game should be 100% 3/5.
And if you say "different game blah blah blah" yes, it is a different game, which is objectively played at a faster pace. How is this even a question?

I agree. I think MKX needs 3/5 more than Injustice did tbh.

 

[OFIDYAN]

I've got a grand idea!

2/3 in pools
3/5 top 32

60 seconds on the clock
Character lock for winning, but not variation locked.

 

[HoneyBee]

I've got a grand idea!

2/3 in pools
3/5 top 32

60 seconds on the clock
Character lock for winning, but not variation locked.

Going down the variation lock road isn't a good idea.