Are Nrs Games The Scrubbiest Games (easiest to learn) in the Fgc?

[trustinme]

Gimmick scrub sports.
enjoy your evening people.

 

[Afk Skinny]

Divekick

Pssh, thats the ultimate footsie test

 

[exflyingbooty]

Execution does not equate to a game being scrubby or not. That depends on the core mechanics of the actual game if a game is "srubby" or not

Deathfist is the hardest input in the game

OH COME ON, IT'S EVIL MIST, i know you kappaing but still
*[]+2+3

 

[Undeadjim]

Execution means nothing. There is a reason FChamp holds the top 3 spots on Rising Thunder with three different accounts lol

The only way I could possibly describe a scruby fighting game would be one that takes away the need for fighting game fundamentals the most.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Pssh, thats the ultimate footsie test

There is no game with lower execution barriers than divekick.

I still wouldnt call it scrubby though. But that seemed to be what the OP was getting at.

 

[PND_Ketchup]

Worth saying that Killer Instinct's execution is almost just as easy in some ways.

Execution definitely isn't what makes a game scrubby. People tend to get salty when they come over to NRS titles and they just say the games are easy mode for bad Fighting Game players.

Funny statement as it always comes from people that never win shit in NRS games.

 

[I GOT HANDS]

Scrubby isn't the right word.

What you mean to call it is easy and I'll admit the game is fairly easy to pick up, except if play as Liu Kang, Kung Lao, Raiden, Jax and Hellfire Scorpion.

Lao and Raiden really don't have that hard execution, Jax can be a challenge but still not ridiculous

On the other hand you left out actual hard characters like Swarm Queen, A-List and Marksman

 

[M.D.]

The only people who say easy execution games are scrubby are the ones that have no clue about reading the opponent, adapting, reacting, footsieing and so on.

They only have one strength, the muscle memory and finger ability to do hard executions so they keep playing those games because the execution barriers keep players away who otherwise would have DESTROYED them and prove how free they are.

Fortunately with SFV made easier, KI being godlike easy on the inputs and Rising Thunder having basically no execution barrier, games will soon get rid of this obstacle and all of those players crying about it will either suicide out of spite or go in the woods playing with squirrels and claiming to still be the best.

 

[B. Shazzy]

Worth saying that Killer Instinct's execution is almost just as easy in some ways.

Execution definitely isn't what makes a game scrubby. People tend to get salty when they come over to NRS titles and they just say the games are easy mode for bad Fighting Game players.

Funny statement as it always comes from people that never win shit in NRS games.

It only makes sense. Why would someone invest time in a game they feel is trash? First impressions mean a lot and whether it's your first time hopping in ranked getting 50/50 by Quan Chi or at higher levels where Quan Chi is still 50/50ing you except now they understand the concept of footsies and optimization.


MKX meta isn't "deep", if you don't like it at first you probably won't enjoy it at higher levels. Not to mention netplay, which hurt this game immensly for newcomers into the scene.


As an aside, KI at higher levels requires manuals with anywhere in between 1-3 frame links back to back at any time for all characters. I think what's possible in KI vs MKX in terms of potential execution aren't comparable just because d'vorah and kung lao have a couple hard links. KI also doesn't have "bnbs" and you're forced to constantly create new combos on the fly which should be taken into consideration.

 

[virtiqaL]

The bottom line... competitive games, fighting or otherwise, are only as difficult as the competition that plays it. It's the competition that raises the bar for difficulty and barrier to entry for high-level play.

 

[Slips]

This game is no scrubbier than any other. It has just as many stupid and exploitative cheap garbage that any other fighter has. I think NRS games just always have a stigma of their games being broken, simple or dumbed down because of the bad stretch of games during the MK 3D era. Plus their games on release typically have a lot of derpy stuff in them before they get patched out...but really that's no different than most games.

Nobody seemed to care in SFIV when Infiltration just air fireballed is way to timeouts. Or when shotos could tatsu out of the corner and run away the whole game. Or when Ultra's did 70% life. Or Seth's jumping fierce that took up 2/3's of the entire screen like an MvC3 move. Or how incredibly stupid and imbalanced Yun and Yang were when they came out. Or the Sentinal debacle when MvC3 released. Or Sadira having unbreakable combos in KI. Elphelt in Guilty Gear has an unblockable loop to this day. And the list goes on, but you get the idea.

It also doesn't help that this community cry's and throws tantrums more than any other. Most players here wanna blame NRS instead of exploring all the options on how to deal with cheap stuff. It's no wonder people think NRS games are scrubby when we have so many players who'd rather whine instead of learn.

 

[Slips]

But like people have said in here before, if NRS games were so easy to learn you'd see other players from other fighting games coming in here trying to take our esports money. That doesn't happen. You actually have to dedicate yourself to be good at NRS games.

 

[Skellington]

It only makes sense. Why would someone invest time in a game they feel is trash? First impressions mean a lot and whether it's your first time hopping in ranked getting 50/50 by Quan Chi or at higher levels where Quan Chi is still 50/50ing you except now they understand the concept of footsies and optimization.


MKX meta isn't "deep", if you don't like it at first you probably won't enjoy it at higher levels. Not to mention netplay, which hurt this game immensly for newcomers into the scene.

Shyyzmm dropping those truth bombs today like it's his job!

 

[VenomX-90]

I mean NRS only has Mortal Kombat that it, besides Injustice. So without IGAU technically it would have been just a game franchise. Well there was a another game they made back in the past besides MK but I think it was a one time thing.

 

[RM Jonnitti]

Bane had some. Found them in May

well regardless, i feel like nrs games evolve at a much slower pace then most other games. a lot of this is because the community is still young for the most part. as the community ages this will be less of an issue

 

[xInfra Deadx]

This game is no scrubbier than any other. It has just as many stupid and exploitative cheap garbage that any other fighter has. I think NRS games just always have a stigma of their games being broken, simple or dumbed down because of the bad stretch of games during the MK 3D era. Plus their games on release typically have a lot of derpy stuff in them before they get patched out...but really that's no different than most games.

Nobody seemed to care in SFIV when Infiltration just air fireballed is way to timeouts. Or when shotos could tatsu out of the corner and run away the whole game. Or when Ultra's did 70% life. Or Seth's jumping fierce that took up 2/3's of the entire screen like an MvC3 move. Or how incredibly stupid and imbalanced Yun and Yang were when they came out. Or the Sentinal debacle when MvC3 released. Or Sadira having unbreakable combos in KI. Elphelt in Guilty Gear has an unblockable loop to this day. And the list goes on, but you get the idea.

It also doesn't help that this community cry's and throws tantrums more than any other. Most players here wanna blame NRS instead of exploring all the options on how to deal with cheap stuff. It's no wonder people think NRS games are scrubby when we have so many players who'd rather whine instead of learn.

Boom. Headshot.

 

[NaCl man]

All the fighting games mentioned are all different. They all have different skills needed. I dont think you can compare them to each other just becasue there are 2 characters on the screen fighting each other.

 

[B. Shazzy]

This game is no scrubbier than any other. It has just as many stupid and exploitative cheap garbage that any other fighter has. I think NRS games just always have a stigma of their games being broken, simple or dumbed down because of the bad stretch of games during the MK 3D era. Plus their games on release typically have a lot of derpy stuff in them before they get patched out...but really that's no different than most games.

Nobody seemed to care in SFIV when Infiltration just air fireballed is way to timeouts. Or when shotos could tatsu out of the corner and run away the whole game. Or when Ultra's did 70% life. Or Seth's jumping fierce that took up 2/3's of the entire screen like an MvC3 move. Or how incredibly stupid and imbalanced Yun and Yang were when they came out. Or the Sentinal debacle when MvC3 released. Or Sadira having unbreakable combos in KI. Elphelt in Guilty Gear has an unblockable loop to this day. And the list goes on, but you get the idea.

It also doesn't help that this community cry's and throws tantrums more than any other. Most players here wanna blame NRS instead of exploring all the options on how to deal with cheap stuff. It's no wonder people think NRS games are scrubby when we have so many players who'd rather whine instead of learn.

The things is, scrubbiness is relative to the game it's in. Which one sounds like it belongs in an nrs/sfiv/ki/etc? OH Low target combo into ex special that jails for another mixup? Safe OH teleport that takes half your life if it hits? Safe meterless vortex for half your life if you guess wrong? 50/50 divebomb otgs for half your life?

While it's true all games have something cheap or scrubby it's all relative to the game mechanics and other characters and are generally unique cases or "toptier". However, when it comes to nrs games 2/3 of the characters elevate the cheapness to such a level that it's almost seems normal and any character without unreactable oh lows, plus +14 launching ex specials/bottom tier, less cheap characters suffer yet still seem "good" or "viable" in nrs games. Sure, maybe in games were ex specials moves don't build meter, chip, launch for half you life while jailingly you on block for another mixup.

If you can't see the difference bewteen what's considered cheap in nrs games and more popular fgs comptitively and relative to the game they're in then idk what to tell you. There maybe scrubbiness in every game, but not all scrubbiness is equal.

 

[GAV]

I don't think the reason Daigo stays away from nrs games is because the combos are too hard or not hard enough.

In fact, I guarantee nobody who stays away from nrs games attributes it to execution issues. Maybe think about it a little harder.

I'm pretty sure it's due to a mix of the community and mostly the game itself that nrs games are low-tier in the fgc, but that shouldn't keep you from playing them or anything.

Daigo stays away because he doesn't like it enough to be Daigo-like in NRS games.

 

[GAV]

@Apologia X why are you dodging the question?

What does "scrubby" mean?

You're asking if the game is the scrubbiest but a billion ppl have asked already what do you mean by "scrubby" and no answer. The thread is pointless until you say what you mean by "scrubby".

Scrubs lose, don't know why, then make threads about the games they don't understand calling them scrubby.

Lets see the OP. Here's a snapshot from his webcam...

 

[EMPEROR_KNICKS]

The things is, scrubbiness is relative to the game it's in. Which one sounds like it belongs in an nrs/sfiv/ki/etc? OH Low target combo into ex special that jails for another mixup? Safe OH teleport that takes half your life if it hits? Safe meterless vortex for half your life if you guess wrong? 50/50 divebomb otgs for half your life?

While it's true all games have something cheap or scrubby it's all relative to the game mechanics and other characters and are generally unique cases or "toptier". However, when it comes to nrs games 2/3 of the characters elevate the cheapness to such a level that it's almost seems normal and any character without unreactable oh lows, plus +14 launching ex specials/bottom tier, less cheap characters suffer yet still seem "good" or "viable" in nrs games. Sure, maybe in games were ex specials moves don't build meter, chip, launch for half you life while jailingly you on block for another mixup.

If you can't see the difference bewteen what's considered cheap in nrs games and more popular fgs competitively and relative to the game they're in then idk what to tell you. There maybe scrubbiness in every game, but not all scrubbiness is equal.

I assume your talking about lao and Quan chi(and by the way no teleport in this game is unpunishable ,even tanyas can be punished) and what divebomb 50/50s? with who) Also in Mk9 il agree there where basically like 5 charachters in tournament, while in mkx every character has dirt that it doesn't matter. Goro is one of my mains, goro is considered a relatively low tier character in this game, yet almost all his useful normals are plus or minus 1-3, so basically 11,121,12,21,f4,b12u2,b122, f23, f232+4, are all plus, i probably even missed some, he also has otgs, an unblockable wakeup, damage and ok zoning and he is in the bottom of the list. Same for all the other lower tiers like Ferra/Torr, have dirt. Also both goro and Ferra Torr placed top 8. Mid tier characters are great top tier is great, everyone is so retarded and has so much that makes it more balanced, and allows for more than 3 characters to place top 8.
Also in terms of so called"Cheapness" Mortal Kombat isnt the cheapest so to speak or in other words many other fighting games have things that are a little ridiculous. For example i play Blazblue Iron tager has a command grab wakeup that takes half your health for all your heat, hazama and azrael are just dumb and just like have everything. In street fighter many ultras basically take half your health, and make comebacks easier. In Umvc3 basically you touch someone and its death, comebacks with xfactor are ridiculous and lead into 1 touch instadeath.
So Mkx maybe scrubby but so are alot of fighting games that rival or surpass your defintion of scrubiness, now i dont view this as scrubby as these are mechanincs but by your definiton mkx isnt that much scrubbier than any other fighting game.

 

[GAV]

Worth saying that Killer Instinct's execution is almost just as easy in some ways.

Execution definitely isn't what makes a game scrubby. People tend to get salty when they come over to NRS titles and they just say the games are easy mode for bad Fighting Game players.

Funny statement as it always comes from people that never win shit in NRS games.

KI execution is way easier, IMO.

It doesn't make me any less scrubby at it though.

 

[B. Shazzy]

I assume your talking about lao and Quan chi(and by the way no teleport in this game is unpunishable ,even tanyas can be punished) and what divebomb 50/50s? with who) Also in Mk9 il agree there where basically like 5 charachters in tournament, while in mkx every character has dirt that it doesn't matter. Goro is one of my mains, goro is considered a relatively low tier character in this game, yet almost all his useful normals are plus or minus 1-3, so basically 11,121,12,21,f4,b12u2,b122, f23, f232+4, are all plus, i probably even missed some, he also has otgs, an unblockable wakeup, damage and ok zoning and he is in the bottom of the list. Same for all the other lower tiers like Ferra/Torr, have dirt. Also both goro and Ferra Torr placed top 8. Mid tier characters are great top tier is great, everyone is so retarded and has so much that makes it more balanced, and allows for more than 3 characters to place top 8.
Also in terms of so called"Cheapness" Mortal Kombat isnt the cheapest so to speak or in other words many other fighting games have things that are a little ridiculous. For example i play Blazblue Iron tager has a command grab wakeup that takes half your health for all your heat, hazama and azrael are just dumb and just like have everything. In street fighter many ultras basically take half your health, and make comebacks easier. In Umvc3 basically you touch someone and its death, comebacks with xfactor are ridiculous and lead into 1 touch instadeath.
So Mkx maybe scrubby but so are alot of fighting games that rival or surpass your defintion of scrubiness, now i dont view this as scrubby as these are mechanincs but by your definiton mkx isnt that much scrubbier than any other fighting game.

I'm referring to nrs games so injustice and mk. Idk anything about BB but I can describe moves in KI like unblockable projectiles into full combos or command grabs that take way more than half your health on hit. But the characters that have these moves aren't even considered top 5 in KI and it's because there's a balance in risk/reward with "cheap" or "scrubby" moves that nrs games typically don't consider in design. KI doesn't get shit from other communities or is toxic like the nrs community while their game is being supported for a 3rd year and prob a 3rd EVO. So the question is if it's not that game that the issue, what is?

Again I'm not saying fgames don't have cheap stuff, it's just most people in the fgc don't like how nrs handles their. cheap stuff. The fgc has spoken.

 

[Green Lantern Rz]

Lao and Raiden really don't have that hard execution, Jax can be a challenge but still not ridiculous

On the other hand you left out actual hard characters like Swarm Queen, A-List and Marksman

Kung Lao:
- Chain fist is hard. Takes time to get used to doing it consistently.
- Connecting his 4-4 after hatspin is even harder cus its a 2 frame link.

Thunder God Raiden:
- LRC into 2-1-3 to extend the combo is hard, especially in the corner for some reason.
- Doing his electric fly after his 1-1-2-2(holding 2) is also hard cus you have to input it in a certain hit of the lightning.

Anyways, I don't find A-List Cage to be hard to execute at all. In fact the only thing hard about him is the knee dash cancel into forward 2 but still not that hard after a few weeks of practice.

 

[youthinkyoubadyouaintbad]

In terms of execution, Smash would be easily the easiest, but there is more to fighting games than doing a command and pressing a button.

In general the games are just different, it's hard to measure, since each game will bring different elements to the table.

So, no, i don't consider MK to be the "scrubiest", nor do i believe there is one, at least among modern fighting games.

Divekick might have easier execution than Smash, it's a bit of a toss-up