General/Other - Johnny Cage Johnny Cage General Discussion Thread

[Movieland KerrHolden]

I guess I'm not familiar with NRS's track record, but with no changes, this is how the game is. Play the matchups, learn the characters and you'll see that they are objectively better. At first I was all aboard the "wait and see" train, but now I've reversed my opinion and I think the game would be pretty good if the characters I mentioned were brought down to everyone else's level. If that happened, Scorp and KL would prolly be the new top tier, but they're so much more in line with everyone else. I'm just wondering what the hell they were thinking.

This isn't even coming from a salt level or something. I mained Cassie, and now I'm pretty much done with her because she has literally no bad matchups. There's not a single character who can give her a tough time. Quan barely goes even with her. Now that I've put serious time into Johnny, Liu, and others, I've just been able to see how ridiculous the top characters are by comparison. It's disgusting how powerful their tools are, given how little effort it takes to use them.

lol that less then 1 month endgame


i ain't gonna touch this, you seemed to have convinced yourself. you can have whatever mentality you want about a game with ~75 characters (and growing)

 

[Fergus]

333 xx EX clone DB1 to 333 xx BF4 deals 11.5% in chip and is all guaranteed after a nutcracker.

So take this meterless combo with 2 clones f24 d1 4 xx DB1 4 xx DB1 NJP 12 114 xx nutpunch.

If you replace it with this combo for 1 clone, F24 D1 4 xx DB1 NJP 12 12 114 xx nutpunch for 40% then tack on the chip thing, you get 51.5% overall which is handy to close a round if you have built a bar after the combo.

If you make them block 333 and you have 2 clones + 2 bars to burn, this is all guaranteed

333 xx EX clone DB1 walk a bit 333 xx EX clone DB1 walk 333 xx DB2/BF4 for 18% chip.

You could sneak a throw in after some of the ex clones if they're just waiting on the chip too.

 

[M.D.]

Anyone noticed that when you get countered , let's say, with Liu Kang's parry, the clones GO AWAY?

Welcome to DAY 1 BANE TIER for fucks sake NRS.

 

[Biologic]

333 xx EX clone DB1 to 333 xx BF4 deals 11.5% in chip and is all guaranteed after a nutcracker.

So take this meterless combo with 2 clones f24 d1 4 xx DB1 4 xx DB1 NJP 12 114 xx nutpunch.

If you replace it with this combo for 1 clone, F24 D1 4 xx DB1 NJP 12 12 114 xx nutpunch for 40% then tack on the chip thing, you get 51.5% overall which is handy to close a round if you have built a bar after the combo.

If you make them block 333 and you have 2 clones + 2 bars to burn, this is all guaranteed

333 xx EX clone DB1 walk a bit 333 xx EX clone DB1 walk 333 xx DB2/BF4 for 18% chip.

You could sneak a throw in after some of the ex clones if they're just waiting on the chip too.

You can actually jump in after an EX rising shadow mimic,

So you could actually do; jump in 1 (1.25%) 3,3,3 (3%) EX Rising shadow (3.5%) jump in 1 (1.25%) 3,3,3 (3%) EX Rising shadow (3.5%) jump in 1 (1.25%) 3,3,3 (3%) for 19.75% of guaranteed chip & then a grab or EX force balls or something, I mentioned this in my Stunt Double guide

 

[Fergus]

You can actually jump in after an EX rising shadow mimic,

So you could actually do; jump in 1 (1.25%) 3,3,3 (3%) EX Rising shadow (3.5%) jump in 1 (1.25%) 3,3,3 (3%) EX Rising shadow (3.5%) jump in 1 (1.25%) 3,3,3 (3%) for 19.75% of guaranteed chip & then a grab or EX force balls or something, I mentioned this in my Stunt Double guide

Oh my bad man, will check that out

 

[RoGE]

I was having too much fun...

 

[M.D.]

Dude you're going to get Cage nerfed wtf ahh hahahahahhahaa

 

[Peckapowa]

At this point it looks like Quan is a overall better char, but I'm not convinced he dominates or even beats Cage. Quan doesn't deal with pressure well. Nor does Raiden.

It'll take time to see how good quan is, he'll prolly get nerfed before then, but i play sonyas and one bat dodge or fuck up and I feel destroyed as soon as she touches me or knocks me down I'm convinced if I play perfect certain chars will not get in ever, cage being on of them, and he's no real threat up close anyways, he has no mixup. But cage has -4 ex kick. I still think at a high level murders him.

I'm convinced cartwheel can be blocked and punished on reaction, so she can be reduced to pure 50/50(minus those cheap ass grabs) but at this point she gets in, corners you, and you get raped and can never get up. I need time to see how will I can defend her. She can be zoned hard too.

Kano beats quan right now, Only because back1 is unbeatable.


Cassie has no weaknesses unlike quan. Her strengths aren't as strong as his. But she has, amazing reversals, strong mixup, anti-air ability, really strong footsie tools and mobility, low hitbox advantages, everything indicative of an nrs top tier. Her missiles are an extremely strong tool, have exceptional recover to where she can dictate some neutrals and destroy offense, and her mb can be used to setup unblockables. She has everything indicative of top tier.


Quan has a cheap vortex and overpowered keepaway, but crappy defense. Hes like a super strong glass cannon. But if done properly his zoning is outrageous and his vortex.

It's a unique situation.

 

[Peckapowa]

Johnnies really good he just isn't auto pilot like a lot of characters. Basic Johnny is free. You really have to play patient and smart.

I'll be using Stunt Double for the Sub matchup for sure lol.

What happens when the other characters aren't played on autopilot??

 

[Peckapowa]

Was messing with his Stunt Double variation the other night. The mimic cancels and mimic moves seem to work well for continued pressure and it gets even better in the corner since it becomes easier to confirm into nut punch. Knowing that the mimic shadow kick and mimic rising punch are PLUS on block changes his game a ton. He gets a pretty good 50/50 in the corner as well. Here's an online set to get an idea:

@Mikemetroid

Solid play, I'm not saying not to do it, but that 113 and 11f2 mixup isn't actually 50/50, it's fuzzed by blocking low then high. It can actually be blocked 100 % of the time because it's the end of a string so there is a timing. It can also be osed out of by mashing on block. Not saying it isn't good to do, plus you could do 11 d4.

I like this new mimic cancel pressure, it's strong but it has one bottleneck, the infrequency of stunt doubles availability.

Now if stunt double gets a recovery buff or you could resummon it, johnny cage will be a character will be a char with great footsies zoning and pressure

 

[NissanZaxima]

It'll take time to see how good quan is, he'll prolly get nerfed before then, but i play sonyas and one bat dodge or fuck up and I feel destroyed as soon as she touches me or knocks me down I'm convinced if I play perfect certain chars will not get in ever, cage being on of them, and he's no real threat up close anyways, he has no mixup. But cage has -4 ex kick. I still think at a high level murders him.

I'm convinced cartwheel can be blocked and punished on reaction, so she can be reduced to pure 50/50(minus those cheap ass grabs) but at this point she gets in, corners you, and you get raped and can never get up. I need time to see how will I can defend her. She can be zoned hard too.

Kano beats quan right now, Only because back1 is unbeatable.


Cassie has no weaknesses unlike quan. Her strengths aren't as strong as his. But she has, amazing reversals, strong mixup, anti-air ability, really strong footsie tools and mobility, low hitbox advantages, everything indicative of an nrs top tier. Her missiles are an extremely strong tool, have exceptional recover to where she can dictate some neutrals and destroy offense, and her mb can be used to setup unblockables. She has everything indicative of top tier.


Quan has a cheap vortex and overpowered keepaway, but crappy defense. Hes like a super strong glass cannon. But if done properly his zoning is outrageous and his vortex.

It's a unique situation.

In theory meta this all sounds swell.

 

[RWDY Nori]

It'll take time to see how good quan is, he'll prolly get nerfed before then, but i play sonyas and one bat dodge or fuck up and I feel destroyed as soon as she touches me or knocks me down I'm convinced if I play perfect certain chars will not get in ever, cage being on of them, and he's no real threat up close anyways, he has no mixup. But cage has -4 ex kick. I still think at a high level murders him.

I'm convinced cartwheel can be blocked and punished on reaction, so she can be reduced to pure 50/50(minus those cheap ass grabs) but at this point she gets in, corners you, and you get raped and can never get up. I need time to see how will I can defend her. She can be zoned hard too.

Kano beats quan right now, Only because back1 is unbeatable.


Cassie has no weaknesses unlike quan. Her strengths aren't as strong as his. But she has, amazing reversals, strong mixup, anti-air ability, really strong footsie tools and mobility, low hitbox advantages, everything indicative of an nrs top tier. Her missiles are an extremely strong tool, have exceptional recover to where she can dictate some neutrals and destroy offense, and her mb can be used to setup unblockables. She has everything indicative of top tier.


Quan has a cheap vortex and overpowered keepaway, but crappy defense. Hes like a super strong glass cannon. But if done properly his zoning is outrageous and his vortex.

It's a unique situation.

Excellent points, espeically on Cassie. I also feel she has no real weaknesses. I think she does almost everything better than Johnny IMO

 

[Anbu]

I didn't see a battle footage thread so I guess I'll post this here. My Johnny vs a some what decent Erron Black. It shows most of my combos and frame traps and such. Feedback is much appreciated.

 

[Epy69zSmallBoys]

I didn't see a battle footage thread so I guess I'll post this here. My Johnny vs a some what decent Erron Black. It shows most of my combos and frame traps and such. Feedback is much appreciated.

Looking very solid sir

 

[Epy69zSmallBoys]

I didn't see a battle footage thread so I guess I'll post this here. My Johnny vs a some what decent Erron Black. It shows most of my combos and frame traps and such. Feedback is much appreciated.

I have only ever used A-list, but after watching this video its really making me want to switch to SD, I'm having trouble with the F3-mimic, any trick to it? Also how best do you train yourself to do the run into F3-mimic combo that you were using?

 

[Rude]

Not seeing Cassie's neutral dominating b12 which can either hit 4 for + frames or confirm into a launcher on hit in addition to her better walk speed, and 46% corner vortex really getting "weeded out". Top tiers like her, Quan, Raiden, Sub Zero, Erron, and Kung Jin don't have gimmicks, they have flat out better tools. There's nothing to adapt to. At the highest level of play, Johnny loses to them hard. He probably does great against the rest of the cast who are much better balanced against eachother

Game looks like it'll have SSB Melee balance, ending up with like 4 tourney viable characters. Rip variety.

Jax and Kano disagree.

 

[phantomxxlord]

Kung Lao's EX hat spin in the tempest variation beats Johnny's f3 run cancels in A-List, making it a pretty hard match-up. What you can do is is that you can cancel the f3 into block as fast as you can and bait the spin.

 

[Gankedddx]

I saw a thread in relation to Case Vs.Kung Jin MU, but has anyone seen a Johnny Cage MU thread before I decide to splurge on here? I've been having an absolute brutal time with Mileena (scrub or legit player) and I'm curious if anyone else is in the same boat.

 

[phantomxxlord]

I'm having a terrible time with Mileena too, very annoying character.

 

[Gankedddx]

I'm having a terrible time with Mileena too, very annoying character.

Sometimes I feel like I get it, other times I don't. I usually block her low mid low string and whatever follow up she goes into fine, but I feel like I just fall for her stupid shenanigans time and time again.

Her and Raiden seem to be the two that cause me the most trouble as of right now when playing A-List. I'm getting a better idea on how to face Raiden after watching a ton of footage over the past few days, but it's not clicking against Mileena.

 

[Wrath0594]

I saw a thread in relation to Case Vs.Kung Jin MU, but has anyone seen a Johnny Cage MU thread before I decide to splurge on here? I've been having an absolute brutal time with Mileena (scrub or legit player) and I'm curious if anyone else is in the same boat.

Maybe it's just all the ones I play, but Mileena looks super trash tier. Even played decently she's so unsafe and her mixups are pretty slow. I mean, her ball does low profile everything. She forces you to approach with her low projectile. Can't see johnny having too much trouble tho. What's she doing specifically that's messing you up so badly?

 

[Peckapowa]

I didn't see a battle footage thread so I guess I'll post this here. My Johnny vs a some what decent Erron Black. It shows most of my combos and frame traps and such. Feedback is much appreciated.

What is mb fireballs on block in stuny double??

 

[Movieland KerrHolden]

I saw a thread in relation to Case Vs.Kung Jin MU, but has anyone seen a Johnny Cage MU thread before I decide to splurge on here? I've been having an absolute brutal time with Mileena (scrub or legit player) and I'm curious if anyone else is in the same boat.

i made one a while ago
http://testyourmight.com/threads/this-is-where-you-fall-down-johnny-cage-matchup-thread.50951/

but no one uses it most peope for JC seem to hop between here, combo thread, and the stunt double tech thread

 

[arthriticbasher]

on mileenas over head low spring you can punish it with f3 rc onto f24 combo of choice. her roll is punish by f24

 

[Gankedddx]

Maybe it's just all the ones I play, but Mileena looks super trash tier. Even played decently she's so unsafe and her mixups are pretty slow. I mean, her ball does low profile everything. She forces you to approach with her low projectile. Can't see johnny having too much trouble tho. What's she doing specifically that's messing you up so badly?

I'm thinking I just get caught off guard with that low string while pressuring and then when I do guess she'll do it or roll, I'll block low and she'll either grab or do an overhead, basic MK stuff. I'm probably being impatient. But I agree, a lot of Mileenas I've seen are total trash and abuse the dive kick as much as any scrub with Scorpion abuses the teleport punch. I'm not saying I'm losing every match against Mileena, it's just been a stupid egg to crack. I'll get it eventually.

i made one a while ago
http://testyourmight.com/threads/this-is-where-you-fall-down-johnny-cage-matchup-thread.50951/

but no one uses it most peope for JC seem to hop between here, combo thread, and the stunt double tech thread

Maybe we should all give it some love then *hint hint.*