Match-up Discussion Kung Lao vs Sonya

[Axel_Redd]

i don't know how to deal with this bitch, it almost seems like doing teleport at all is completely worthless. i can't really catch her with anything because she ducks almost everything, which then leaves me with either spin which can be armored thru. A jump which sometimes she reverses imputs and catches me anyways, or a throw which she can just armor thru too.

How am i supposed to beat all that.

 

[Bildslash]

Bird Lao.

Seriously, no joke.

 

[Axel_Redd]

Bird Lao.

Seriously, no joke.

i know about birdlao, it is a legit tactic, trouble is i don't know what to do when she has me, aside from waiting for her to try and block a spin and throw her or poke out and dash back i don't know what else to do. and even then she usually divekicks me :/

 

[Chongo]

i know about birdlao, it is a legit tactic, trouble is i don't know what to do when she has me, aside from waiting for her to try and block a spin and throw her or poke out and dash back i don't know what else to do. and even then she usually divekicks me :/

If she starts pressuring you with a string, duck and punish. Most of her stuff is high hitting.

 

[Axel_Redd]

also lets say i do manage to get a tele-3 or delayed tele-3 on block, where do i go from there?

 

[Axel_Redd]

If she starts pressuring you with a string, duck and punish. Most of her stuff is high hitting.

its her d4 thats giving me troubles, i coudln't seem to read it when it was comming, it just came out of no where. and also the fact that she's got that stupid air to air combo by following up with d4~cartwheel pisses me off >:I

 

[Bildslash]

i know about birdlao, it is a legit tactic, trouble is i don't know what to do when she has me, aside from waiting for her to try and block a spin and throw her or poke out and dash back i don't know what else to do. and even then she usually divekicks me :/

Elaborate on "i don't know what to do when she has me".

 

[Chongo]

its her d4 thats giving me troubles, i coudln't seem to read it when it was comming, it just came out of no where. and also the fact that she's got that stupid air to air combo by following up with d4~cartwheel pisses me off >:I

First key to beat her is to stop teleporting and stop doing divikiku. Play patient and bait out her stuff.

 

[Axel_Redd]

Elaborate on "i don't know what to do when she has me".

when she gets that 112 and starts her MS & divekick shenanigans -.-.

and what if i do land a tele-3 or delayed tele-3 on block?

 

[Bildslash]

when she gets that 112 and starts her MS & divekick shenanigans -.-.

and what if i do land a tele-3 or delayed tele-3 on block?

Unless it was from a JIP 112 can be ducked and interrupted like Chongo said.

Now, if she gets you with 112 ~ MS 1 [xx CW], simply block it and work from there:

-If she only did MS 1 you have to somewhat respect the follow up since you're at -1. She can't do 112 again because it can be ducked, d1 into anything is interruptable (with the exception of CW of course) , a divekick is combo punishable on block or interrupted by s2, and on read you can beat her d4 with d3 or Spin. You need to pay attention the first few times to see what follow up your opponent uses.

-If she went ahead and used CW you're at advantage which means you can Bird Lao your way out, throw, or chip.

If you land a Tele-3 simply use KL mixup tools: 11, 1121, 21, 21212, 24, Spin, Throw and at times Low Hat. Even with her hurtbox she's no different than the rest of the cast.

You mentioned the air-to-air trade. If you're using Bird Lao that shouldn't be an issue, because instant JKDK it's supposed to beat everything but another instant JK or certain special AAs.

Using Bird Lao saves you from "getting catched".

 

[Axel_Redd]

Unless it was from a JIP 112 can be ducked and interrupted like Chongo said.

Now, if she gets you with 112 ~ MS 1 [xx CW], simply block it and work from there:

-If she only did MS 1 you have to somewhat respect the follow up since you're at -1. She can't do 112 again because it can be ducked, d1 into anything is interruptable (with the exception of CW of course) , a divekick is combo punishable on block or interrupted by s2, and on read you can beat her d4 with d3 or Spin. You need to pay attention the first few times to see what follow up your opponent uses.

-If she went ahead and used CW you're at advantage which means you can Bird Lao your way out, throw, or chip.

If you land a Tele-3 simply use KL mixup tools: 11, 1121, 21, 21212, 24, Spin, Throw and at times Low Hat. Even with her hurtbox she's no different than the rest of the cast.

You mentioned the air-to-air trade. If you're using Bird Lao that shouldn't be an issue, because instant JKDK it's supposed to beat everything but another instant JK or certain special AAs.

Using Bird Lao saves you from "getting catched".

wait, MS 1 or MS +1?

 

[Bildslash]

wait, MS 1 or MS +1?

Same thing, pressing 1 after MS only results in one thing.

 

[Axel_Redd]

but can't they also still duck a 21 even if u get delayed tele-3 on block? so what then?

 

[Axel_Redd]

Same thing, pressing 1 after MS only results in one thing.

im srry, I mean MS F1, my bad

 

[Bildslash]

im srry, I mean MS F1, my bad

That one, the 2 low hit string.

 

[Axel_Redd]

That one, the 2 low hit string.

thats what u were talking about right? she's at +1 on that?

 

[Bildslash]

thats what u were talking about right? she's at +1 on that?

Yes, check the frame data.

 

[Badboy Takuma]

If she starts pressuring you with a string, duck and punish. Most of her stuff is high hitting.

Sonya can pressure KL with d1 (6f) ~MSF1 (+1) follow up
Also Jump in punch strings nail and cant be crouch.

 

[Bildslash]

Sonya can pressure KL with d1 (6f) ~MSF1 (+1) follow up
Also Jump in punch strings nail and cant be crouch.

No she can't. There's a 25f gap. KL can Spin her out of any non-armored follow up from d1.

 

[Death]

5-5 vs bird Lao. 7-3 vs KL who spin like crazy and do 24low hat.

2 completely different mus

 

[Axel_Redd]

5-5 vs bird Lao. 7-3 vs KL who spin like crazy and do 24low hat.

2 completely different mus

k, its possible to do bird lao and mix in a few teleports here and there right? as a sort of conditioning.

 

[coolwhip]

k, its possible to do bird lao and mix in a few teleports here and there right? as a sort of conditioning.

I wouldn't get too teleport happy against Sonya due to her uppercut, though if you want to risk it, might as well go with late tele 3. If your opponent is a touch slower to react, it's a full combo. Where I would throw the teleport however is on cross-up. Sonya players love their uppercut, and while it's useful to her in this match-up, you can actually turn it against her by doing crossover teles. If you don't know what that is, it's jump over Sonya as if you're going to cross her up only to teleport midway through your jump (Kung Lao would reappear on the same side). If she reacts to your jump with an uppercut (many Sonya players do), it will whiff, and the late tele 3 will full combo her for over 40%.

 

[Axel_Redd]

I wouldn't get too teleport happy against Sonya due to her uppercut, though if you want to risk it, might as well go with late tele 3. If your opponent is a touch slower to react, it's a full combo. Where I would throw the teleport however is on cross-up. Sonya players love their uppercut, and while it's useful to her in this match-up, you can actually turn it against her by doing crossover teles. If you don't know what that is, it's jump over Sonya as if you're going to cross her up only to teleport midway through your jump (Kung Lao would reappear on the same side). If she reacts to your jump with an uppercut (many Sonya players do), it will whiff, and the late tele 3 will full combo her for over 40%.

yeah i know what that is . Its just that delayed tele-3 doesnt jail on block, so what do i do with that?

 

[coolwhip]

yeah i know what that is . Its just that delayed tele-3 doesnt jail on block, so what do i do with that?

It depends on how your opponent reacts. Many players seem to think it jails so they just sit there and do nothing. In that case just keep getting block strings. However, others who know better will likely either uppercut or D1 (which will generally beat everything you try to do after delayed 3 except for spin). See what they're doing and react accordingly. If it's an uppercut, neutral duck and whiff punish with a full combo (21 spin). If it's a d1, you can block and counterpoke, or just spin it immediately if you read it. If you read an ex cartwheel you can neutral jump punch for a combo.

 

[Big Pampering]

It depends on how your opponent reacts. Many players seem to think it jails so they just sit there and do nothing. In that case just keep getting block strings. However, others who know better will likely either uppercut or D1 (which will generally beat everything you try to do after delayed 3 except for spin). See what they're doing and react accordingly. If it's an uppercut, neutral duck and whiff punish with a full combo (21 spin). If it's a d1, you can block and counterpoke, or just spin it immediately if you read it. If you read an ex cartwheel you can neutral jump punch for a combo.

if they respect your delay 3 because they arent sure whether they can beat your tele 3 fast enough and they dont want to risk losing 43% they will block the tele delay 3. some players like to wait for your 1121 follow up and uppercut you in between strings because that is sometimes possible in that situation, dont know why. I always go for tele 3 21 combo since you cant uppercut in between 21 and it is faster and more damaging, havent seen anyone else use 21 after tele delay 3 and dont know why.

after tele 3 on block you can still go for safe chip damage against most characters because youre still a little at + after tele delay 3. so what I like to do is after the tele delay 3 is a jumpkick divekick over the opponent for free chip against most characters.

there is no need to go for teleport unless its a tele 3 or tele 2 into combo in most situations though, instant teleport doesnt give you the reward for the risk youre taking.