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Match-up Discussion Johnny Cage Mu chart

Maxter

Maxter

Noob
Looks pretty good but i have some changes.

Scorpion: 7-3
Sub-Zero: 4-6
Reptile: 6-4
Ermac: 6-4
Noob: 6-4
Smoke: 5-5
Rain: 6-4
Mileena: 6-4
Kitana: 5-5
Jade: 6-4
Skarlet: 5-5
Sektor: 5-5
Cyrax: 6-4
Cyber Sub: 5-5
Kenshi: 3-7
Freddy: 3-7
Sindel: 7-3
Sonya: 5-5
Jax: 6-4
Stryker: 6-4
Liu Kang: 5-5
Kung Lao: 5-5
Kano: 7-3
Nightwolf: 7-3
Kabal: 3-7
Baraka: 7-3
Shang Tsung: 5-5
Quan Chi: 6-4
Raiden: 6-4
Sheeva: 7-3

Just some changes but everything was pretty much on point on my book, still its just an opinion based on my experience with JC, feel free to discuss.
 
HGTV DrFlash44

HGTV DrFlash44

Quan Cheese!!!
Maxter said:
Looks pretty good but i have some changes.

Scorpion: 7-3
Sub-Zero: 4-6
Reptile: 6-4
Ermac: 6-4
Noob: 6-4
Smoke: 5-5
Rain: 6-4
Mileena: 6-4
Kitana: 5-5
Jade: 6-4
Skarlet: 5-5
Sektor: 5-5
Cyrax: 6-4
Cyber Sub: 5-5
Kenshi: 3-7
Freddy: 3-7
Sindel: 7-3
Sonya: 5-5
Jax: 6-4
Stryker: 6-4
Liu Kang: 5-5
Kung Lao: 5-5
Kano: 7-3
Nightwolf: 7-3
Kabal: 3-7
Baraka: 7-3
Shang Tsung: 5-5
Quan Chi: 6-4
Raiden: 6-4
Sheeva: 7-3

Just some changes but everything was pretty much on point on my book, still its just an opinion based on my experience with JC, feel free to discuss.
Click to expand...
Sindel 7-3? I'm not trying to argue I don't play either character, but why?
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Noob
Glass_Sword said:
Honestly I think Johnny Cage beats Scorpion worse than 7-3. I have been called out about it before and told I am wrong, but here is why...
1. Johnny Cage dominates the up close game. This is especially bad for Scorpion because he does not have any meterless escape options besides down 1 against Johnny Cage. I need to do more research on to it but there are times when you try to get out with enhanced takedown and you will go under Cage and end up on the other side. Also enhanced spear whiffs on Cage if he is ducking so it is a risk to use it on a savvy Cage.
2. Meter, meter, and meter since Johnny Cage gets so much easy pressure on Scorpion he has a lot of meter at ALL times. This makes Scorpions primary tool the vortex that much harder to pull off. You have to catch Cage twice in it most of the time before you can ever get into the 50/50. Not to mention the only meter Scorpion is going to be getting is from taking damage.
3.Spacing and footsies are skewed significantly in Cages favor since he does not even have to open Scorpion up he just has to touch him even if Scorpion blocks Cage is in and the battle has turned for the worst for the Ninja. Johnny has a better walk speed and fast far reaching normals which Scorpion lacks. I'm not going to even acknowledged jumping at Cage as an option.
4. Hell fire becomes a risk in this match up since Johnny Cage never has to jump against Scorpion EVER (well if a hell fire will kill, but that is a given.) Johnny Cage is more than willing to eat a few hell fires to get into Scorpions grill and start throwing out knees.
Honestly the only way Scorpion should win is if he goes into vortex asap and guesses right every time.
MITDJT I remember you once said you would just space out Cage's with back 2 and forward 4 into vortex, but that was back at EVO. You clearly just had better fundamentals and spacing than whatever Johnny Cages you were fighting. There is no way and hell that Scorpion vs. Cage is just a 7-3 when Cage has this many advantages.
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um 8-2 mus are those that you are pretty much screwed completely and you can't do anything really. With no vortex/ scorpion not having armor then i'd call it 8-2 because you'd have nothing really effective to use vs him. Since I can still play footsies with my 50/50s, use d4s, and grab him if he tries to just block, those options save me from just getting completely dominated. Yeah up close cage is a pain since scorpion has sucky pokes and his armor move is decent at best, but get a grab in and you send him full screen, his d4 has great reach, and if you land the vortex, you have many options to mess with cage. I'm not fluffing up the mu in anyway, but I know for a fact scorpion has no 8-2s, sonya wrecks him, but scorpion always has options to keep it competitive or even get that lucky win in there. Vortex is the main reason why he doesn't lose worse to some characters/ him having no good pokes keeps him from being mid tier or better.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Noob
A F0xy Grampa said:
The only way Cage should lose to Quan is ignorance, which is probably abundent among Cage players.
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i'm changing it to 7-3 lol, i remember using quan vs the cages in the vegas crew and it didn't turn out well lmao. Cage just rapes him up close and quan has slow ass normals, decent at best zoning, and suck ass pokes haha.
 
Smarrgasm

Smarrgasm

What's a Smarrgasm?
I agree with rain being 5-5. Cage is better up close and Ex-nut punch makes my pressure more risky but rains armor is just as dangerous for cage. Just an all out up close and footsie battle.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Noob
Maxter said:
Looks pretty good but i have some changes.

Scorpion: 7-3
Sub-Zero: 4-6
Reptile: 6-4
Ermac: 6-4
Noob: 6-4
Smoke: 5-5
Rain: 6-4
Mileena: 6-4
Kitana: 5-5
Jade: 6-4
Skarlet: 5-5
Sektor: 5-5
Cyrax: 6-4
Cyber Sub: 5-5
Kenshi: 3-7
Freddy: 3-7
Sindel: 7-3
Sonya: 5-5
Jax: 6-4
Stryker: 6-4
Liu Kang: 5-5
Kung Lao: 5-5
Kano: 7-3
Nightwolf: 7-3
Kabal: 3-7
Baraka: 7-3
Shang Tsung: 5-5
Quan Chi: 6-4
Raiden: 6-4
Sheeva: 7-3

Just some changes but everything was pretty much on point on my book, still its just an opinion based on my experience with JC, feel free to discuss.
Click to expand...
hmm cyrax losing to cage, that's the only one I'd like to ask about since I thought you'd have it even or rax favor. Interested on smoke cage being a 5-5 as well, thought all cages had that 6-4, but maybe not. I could see that being a 5-5 though since smoke has stupid damage, great pokes, and superb footsies.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Noob
Maxter said:
JC is a tank, sindel can't win this matchup by just zoning, her d1 is too short, she has no good armor, once cage is in it might be over.
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Yeah up close cage rapes her, the only thing keeping him from her is her footsies/zoning, but once he's in, she is screwed haha bcuz she is going to have to back herself up to the corner bcuz she dnt want to approach her.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Noob
Mikemetroid said:
Pretty Solid, I think he goes even with Reptile though.
Click to expand...
care to elaborate? i want all the input possible so we can make this chart super legit. My biggest factor in cage winning is reptiles slow ass normals and trouble getting out of his pressure safely and effectively.
 
Maxter

Maxter

Noob
Cage is just another top 5 character out of the top 10 top 5s, he is only unlucky other top 5s like Eddie, Kenshi, and Kabal makes his life miserable, the subzero one is winnable and might be a 5-5, cage just need patience and try to hit Sub with random projectiles when he uses clone, a good cage might make sub come to him.
 
Mikemetroid

Mikemetroid

Who hired this guy, WTF?
MITDJT said:
care to elaborate? i want all the input possible so we can make this chart super legit. My biggest factor in cage winning is reptiles slow ass normals and trouble getting out of his pressure safely and effectively.
Click to expand...
Short hitbox really negates any fb pressure(13exfb only works when its jailed), his zoning is decent full screen, he has the ability to dash out of pressure (granted it can also be baited just like KL's spin). I do find it funny that Reptile splat tech just doesn't work on Cage, flipkick erryday. haha
 
sub_on_dubs

sub_on_dubs

Online Scrub Lord
It seems like in tournamnet Cage always beats Cyrax, but he could just be getting lucky. Maxter's Cage has beaten many Cyraxes and I believe Dizzy does it on consistent basis as well.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Noob
HGTV DrFlash44 said:
So does smoke and that's 6-4, but your saying 6-4 so that's fine
Click to expand...
smoke has resets though bruh, sindel does have resets but definitely alot more harder execution wise. Smoke has better pokes and footsies as well and a projectile that leads to a full combo and overhead that makes ppl stand up on him alot haha. Sindel however does has interesting stuff with her levi cancels, fb's, and doctrinedark's video showed some crazy stuff she is capable of. I've also played mr.mil some online and she can hold her own for sure, the reason cage wins is up close, she has trouble getting out of pressure.
 
Mikemetroid

Mikemetroid

Who hired this guy, WTF?
sub_on_dubs said:
It seems like in tournamnet Cage always beats Cyrax, but he could just be getting lucky. Maxter's Cage has beaten many Cyraxes and I believe Dizzy does it on consistent basis as well.
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Maxter mains Cyrax - lots of Cyrax practice
GGA Dizzy trains with GGA HAN all the time, who is one of THE BEST with Cyrax.

Me however? fuck Cyrax makes me cry, but I have never met him in tournament only casuals.

EDIT: 2nd thought I did meet him in tournament at NEC last year vs Noobe. That was a close match
 
Mr. Mileena

Mr. Mileena

Noob
MITDJT said:
smoke has resets though bruh, sindel does have resets but definitely alot more harder execution wise. Smoke has better pokes and footsies as well and a projectile that leads to a full combo and overhead that makes ppl stand up on him alot haha. Sindel however does has interesting stuff with her levi cancels, fb's, and doctrinedark's video showed some crazy stuff she is capable of. I've also played mr.mil some online and she can hold her own for sure, the reason cage wins is up close, she has trouble getting out of pressure.
Click to expand...
Levi Cancel can be canceled on reaction to a jump in at any point in her peak, followed with a hair whip grab. If you do not wish to change positions, follow through with the low fireball to catch him mid air.

Her hair whip is a godlike AA I have noticed, with good reach.

Everyone is used to a Sindel that only runs away, and it might surprise you to have a sindel playing footsies before she is cornered with cage.

If her zoning was not angled, it would be 7-3
She deals chip and gains extra meter.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Noob
sub_on_dubs said:
It seems like in tournamnet Cage always beats Cyrax, but he could just be getting lucky. Maxter's Cage has beaten many Cyraxes and I believe Dizzy does it on consistent basis as well.
Click to expand...
i feel that the cyrax's might be getting too scared when cage gets in, he is scary when he's in, but cyrax has ways to keep him off and zone him out effectively. I believe maxter/dizzy win vs rax's bcuz they are just great players, i can beat high lvl rax's with cage too, that is just us being good players and overcoming the difficulties of a mu.
 
YOMI MITYEAP

YOMI MITYEAP

Noob
Mr. Mileena said:
Levi Cancel can be canceled on reaction to a jump in at any point in her peak, followed with a hair whip grab. If you do not wish to change positions, follow through with the low fireball to catch him mid air.

Her hair whip is a godlike AA I have noticed, with good reach.

Everyone is used to a Sindel that only runs away, and it might surprise you to have a sindel playing footsies before she is cornered with cage.

If her zoning was not angled, it would be 7-3
She deals chip and gains extra meter.
Click to expand...
yes indeed, she doesn't have to just run away the whole fight, she has tools for footsies and rushing characters down.
 
Mr. Mileena

Mr. Mileena

Noob
MITDJT said:
i feel that the cyrax's might be getting too scared when cage gets in, he is scary when he's in, but cyrax has ways to keep him off and zone him out effectively. I believe maxter/dizzy win vs rax's bcuz they are just great players, i can beat high lvl rax's with cage too, that is just us being good players and overcoming the difficulties of a mu.
Click to expand...
Jade does lose 6-4, but it may be 7-3 because I find that EX Glow gets stuffed so much more in that matchup, which means she is fucked.
I'll say 6-4 Cage though.

Kitana I have at 5-5, but it may be 6-4 Kitana
 
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