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Where is the moral outrage over Xbox One`s DRM?

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
The issue with MS is that they don't care about how things were, they care about the future, thus rather we want it or not, they will force that future on us.

A large part of this is MS trying to appeal to more than the gamer and too much time listening to the publishers, let us not confuse with the developer, they are two different things. The publisher is only distributing the product, the dev. actually made it. The publishers want DRM and they are also the ones who will come up with excuses like Used Games are killing their profits. They lose money and find a scapegoat all the time. At one time it was rentals they felt people weren't buying games because they can rent them, then it was piracy, they made excuses and imaginary numbers to attest and prove these things, such as Ubisoft did awhile back by making a bold statement saying that 90% of their customers were pirates, when questioned where they got such statistics, they couldn't even provide proof, they still have yet to even prove the validity of said statement. Now the issue is used games, because of stores like Game Stop. Today if I buy a guitar, Fender gets a cut of that sale, but if I go and pick up a Fender Strat. from a pawn shop Fender gets nothing, this is just not how the entertainment industry views this. They actually believe that if you buy a DVD and your whole family watches it at home, that each person in the room should have to pay full price for the DVD as well, so say the DVD was 20 bucks, well this mean your kids and spouse/lover should also pay too. The music industry views it the same as well, they also believe that every time you and a friend hear a song on the radio you both owe money to the publisher for hearing the song, even though it was on the radio. This is the greed of the entertainment industry, which BTW was behind the SOPA bill.

MS is also doing this to gain more money from an initial sale, they do charge a fee just to use your internet already a system that seemed to prove acceptable by all the millions out there that currently use XBL, even though they bring far less advantage over having a PS+ account, which is optional when wanting to p+lay games online on the PSN. Now this will be a requirement to even use the XB1, so every XB1 is a guaranteed XBL subscription for them, it will be required after all, they are alienating independent retailers by only allowing approved MS retailers to resell the games, which likely won't work either, because every publisher is going capitalize on forcing extra out of the consumer with DRM measures, lest we forget how bad DRM can be, just look at older Ubisoft titles, Diablo 3, and Sim City. If one really wants to understand look at Spore, which only allowed you to install the game 3 times, lastly look at almost any Windows operating system on the market, I have even had MS tell me that I had to RE-BUY a key from them at full price of the Win. 7, because I have installed my OS too many times. You see these companies think that you didn't buy their game, you paid for a license and they are giving you permission to use the game and they can revoke that at any time they feel.

It is these things I have mapped out above and consumers have given in for so long that it won't change, just look at Diablo 3 and how quick it sold and how anti-consumerist that game was, look how everyone has bought on to the DLC band wagon, or how folks have given in to the online pass scams. The only reason these practices aren't even illegal is due the law not catching up to technology.

The XB1 is the direct result of all the past issues that consumers have just been slowly buying into and telling MS and others we are fine by it, well maybe finally they well lose.
Ok while I agree with a lot of this and its a great post but Piracy is the main cavity of all this
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
Ok while I agree with a lot of this and its a great post but Piracy is the main cavity of all this
Not really, there really isn't much evidence to prove it actually, if anything these practices mostly proved to encourage piracy. Look CD Projekt Red, the developer and publisher of the Witcher games. They suddenly started making huge sales once they dropped their DRM practices altogether. This an industry that wants to turn your purchases into a service now, they feel they reserve the right to tell you how you will consume their product. The truth is that when you buy a product you are allowed to do what ever you want with it, your are just not allowed to copy and sell it. These companies want to stop you from doing even allowing another person to borrow the product from you. As I said they feel everyone should pay regardless.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Not really, there really isn't much evidence to prove it actually, if anything these practices mostly proved to encourage piracy. Look CD Projekt Red, the developer and publisher of the Witcher games. They suddenly started making huge sales once they dropped their DRM practices altogether. This an industry that wants to turn your purchases into a service now, they feel they reserve the right to tell you how you will consume their product. The truth is that when you buy a product you are allowed to do what ever you want with it, your are just not allowed to copy and sell it. These companies want to stop you from doing even allowing another person to borrow the product from you. As I said they feel everyone should pay regardless.
I COMPLETELY disagree.

The year napster came out was the beginning of the end of 80% of music industry jobs and revenue and the industry hasnt recovered still and has been forced to completely down size on all levels
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Not really, there really isn't much evidence to prove it actually, if anything these practices mostly proved to encourage piracy. Look CD Projekt Red, the developer and publisher of the Witcher games. They suddenly started making huge sales once they dropped their DRM practices altogether. This an industry that wants to turn your purchases into a service now, they feel they reserve the right to tell you how you will consume their product. The truth is that when you buy a product you are allowed to do what ever you want with it, your are just not allowed to copy and sell it. These companies want to stop you from doing even allowing another person to borrow the product from you. As I said they feel everyone should pay regardless.
Btw again Im not agreeing with how MS is handling this but I do stand concrete on Piracy being a major problem that destroyed music all together and forced the industry into a bag of shit.

If Movies were as quick, easy and free to pirate do you not think that the industry would take a huge hurt?
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
I COMPLETELY disagree.

The year napster came out was the beginning of the end of 80% of music industry jobs and revenue and the industry hasnt recovered still and has been forced to completely down size on all levels
I agree that Napster really hurt the music industry and the file sharing sites hurt it as well, but essentially the game industry is still a multi-billion dollar industry that even makes more than the movie industry does as well. Here is another issue if piracy was truly the issue, these upcoming next gen systems, due to there architecture will be even easier for people to pirate and port to a PC, also since it takes much more know how to mod and pirate a console and console based games. The issue again is not piracy its again an industry doing anything they can to milk an extra dime out of its consumers. Lets look at Diablo 3 again, why is it always online, it actually isn't piracy, it has to do with their Real Money Auction House(RMAH), which Blizzard takes a 15% cut of every transaction made in the game. The whole game itself is built around forcing you to use it, from the way loot drops to the way you have to always be connected. Look at ME3's day one DLC, the publisher has even stated before that they were so happy that they were able to make a 60 dollar game turn into a 70 to 8- dollar purchase.

XB 1 has little to nothing to do with used game or piracy it has everything to do with milking a consumer for more.
EDIT: sorry didn't catch your post til after my response...
The music industry has been dying industry for years and Napster, though did hurt them has help relieve them, which if it were not for them, the digital distribution of music wouldn't have ever come along, we would still be buying CDs all the time instead of downloading it. Napster if anything did help move the industry forward.
 

Saint Op Omen

Savagely beating his super-ego with his id...
Btw again Im not agreeing with how MS is handling this but I do stand concrete on Piracy being a major problem that destroyed music all together and forced the industry into a bag of shit.

If Movies were as quick, easy and free to pirate do you not think that the industry would take a huge hurt?
There are a lot of reasons why that happened to the music industry...piracy is a small part
Itunes,youtube,sat radio,subscription services...all played the part also...

Sent under duress.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
I agree that Napster really hurt the music industry and the file sharing sites hurt it as well, but essentially the game industry is still a multi-billion dollar industry that even makes more than the movie industry does as well. Here is another issue if piracy was truly the issue, these upcoming next gen systems, due to there architecture will be even easier for people to pirate and port to a PC, also since it takes much more know how to mod and pirate a console and console based games. The issue again is not piracy its again an industry doing anything they can to milk an extra dime out of its consumers. Lets look at Diablo 3 again, why is it always online, it actually isn't piracy, it has to do with their Real Money Auction House(RMAH), which Blizzard takes a 15% cut of every transaction made in the game. The whole game itself is built around forcing you to use it, from the way loot drops to the way you have to always be connected. Look at ME3's day one DLC, the publisher has even stated before that they were so happy that they were able to make a 60 dollar game turn into a 70 to 8- dollar purchase.

XB 1 has little to nothing to do with used game or piracy it has everything to do with milking a consumer for more.
I was a massive D2 fan and when d3 came out with that shit i said NO

I agree man
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
There are a lot of reasons why that happened to the music industry...piracy is a small part
Itunes,youtube,sat radio,subscription services...all played the part also...

Sent under duress.
Honestly no

Napster was the big bang then Music industry went into a frenzy looking for ways to save their industry which later led to youtube partnership

itunes destroyed "the album" but saved the "Single"
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
I was a massive D2 fan and when d3 came out with that shit i said NO

I agree man
Believe me it took my wife threatening to leave me to not buy that POS, I will buy it on the PS3 though since its proving thus far to become the definitive version of the game.
 

Saint Op Omen

Savagely beating his super-ego with his id...
Honestly no

Napster was the big bang then Music industry went into a frenzy looking for ways to save their industry which later led to youtube partnership

itunes destroyed "the album" but saved the "Single"
When Napster hit everyone I knew thought it was perfectly fine and was all shocked when it wasn't..
I know that hit hard but now the reasons I listed are why like you said the album is dead...
But I don't know anyone that pirates music still...there are to many options..
Many people in music will say that if you can't still make tons of money your just not very good...(to be fair good music is hard to find these days)
There is not going to be a napster for games...

Sent under duress.
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
BTW Pig I was one of the few in full support of Metallica when they went after Napster, because I myself am a musician and to this day never pirate music simply to support the artist. Besides its so easy now to sample an album before purchase to know if I'm gonna like the album.
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
When Napster hit everyone I knew thought it was perfectly fine and was all shocked when it wasn't..
I know that hit hard but now the reasons I listed are why like you said the album is dead...
But I don't know anyone that pirates music still...there are to many options..
Many people in music will say that if you can't still make tons of money your just not very good...(to be fair good music is hard to find these days)
There is not going to be a napster for games...

Sent under duress.
No a games Napster is never gonna happen, but the reason we need to be in protest of the XB1 is because they want to move to a all digital distribution service and away from printing physical disks now. With a digital service they can regulate how, when, and where you will play your games and then you are also giving them the ability to restrict or even revoke your access to these games. Its also a move to reduce costs. Now I'm not against digital distribution at all, but one needs to understand how it can be abused by corporations.
 
I'm going to be playing Killzone
Thanks for the offer, but I'm straight.

PS: Fuck the X-Box Done. PS4 all the way and not even Killer Instinct will convince me otherwise. Even nostalgia has its critical limit and for me that limit was reached, when they said TV and Sports three times in 20 seconds during their "press conference".
Also, them cancelling ALL of the post E3 press conferences is like saying: "Look at us, world, we are fucking retaaaaarded! We don't know what's going ooooon, eeeeeeeeeh, moneeeeey! Exclusive DLC for the first month on the X-Box: Go home"
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
When Napster hit everyone I knew thought it was perfectly fine and was all shocked when it wasn't..
I know that hit hard but now the reasons I listed are why like you said the album is dead...
But I don't know anyone that pirates music still...there are to many options..
Many people in music will say that if you can't still make tons of money your just not very good...(to be fair good music is hard to find these days)
There is not going to be a napster for games...

Sent under duress.
I dont agree with that

Classic and phenom artists such as Jimi hendrix would have no chance in making it in todays industry because no one would take that investment into him and the recordings he was allowed to make w his own artist freedom would not exist today because it would be viewed as a risk and the industry doesnt condone risks since 1998
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
No a games Napster is never gonna happen, but the reason we need to be in protest of the XB1 is because they want to move to a all digital distribution service and away from printing physical disks now. With a digital service they can regulate how, when, and where you will play your games and then you are also giving them the ability to restrict or even revoke your access to these games. Its also a move to reduce costs. Now I'm not against digital distribution at all, but one needs to understand how it can be abused by corporations.
if downloading a xbox live game, properly burning it, flashing your xbox was as easy as downloading a 3mb song it'd be a major problem
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
BTW Pig I was one of the few in full support of Metallica when they went after Napster, because I myself am a musician and to this day never pirate music simply to support the artist. Besides its so easy now to sample an album before purchase to know if I'm gonna like the album.
yea me too and dude honestly while we're at it

RHCP and pearl jam were right about ticket master yet myself and others were sheep and believed the negative press they got about it. Pearl jam never recovered
 

Saint Op Omen

Savagely beating his super-ego with his id...
No a games Napster is never gonna happen, but the reason we need to be in protest of the XB1 is because they want to move to a all digital distribution service and away from printing physical disks now. With a digital service they can regulate how, when, and where you will play your games and then you are also giving them the ability to restrict or even revoke your access to these games. Its also a move to reduce costs. Now I'm not against digital distribution at all, but one needs to understand how it can be abused by corporations.
No I got you on that...almost nothing short of we own all the studios will make me get an xbone over ps4 at launch...for a ton of reasons...
But piracy did not kill music ...music killed music..

Sent under duress.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
No I got you on that...almost nothing short of we own all the studios will make me get an xbone over ps4 at launch...for a ton of reasons...
But piracy did not kill music ...music killed music..

Sent under duress.
Music that could save music you or i will never hear because no industry exec will invest in it or back it unless its Ke$ha or beiber
 

Saint Op Omen

Savagely beating his super-ego with his id...
I dont agree with that

Classic and phenom artists such as Jimi hendrix would have no chance in making it in todays industry because no one would take that investment into him and the recordings he was allowed to make w his own artist freedom would not exist today because it would be viewed as a risk and the industry doesnt condone risks since 1998
He would not sound like he did if he was just starting now so no that's not a point to discuss...

But the risk involved is a major part of what really killed music not p2p...overinflation of the market false return due to the early 90s where everyone rebought the music as cds ...tons of start up buying into everything...it was like the dotcom crash later...or the housing bubble...p2p happened at the right time to keep it relevent...but was not a cause...

And if we are saying 2chains is better then Hendrix I will beat a puppy with a kitten...

Sent under duress.
 

TheSpore

Nurgle Chaos God of Death and Disease
Well the music industry is strange now and how it ahs always worked, for instance one thing many forget is that artist such as Elvis didn't really write much of their own music other wrote it for him. This highly relevant in the pop, country, and hip-hop genres, it is processed music written and done by others and the vocalist are all that provide just their voice. Its all the commercialization that killed the industry mostly, the publishers and companies like Ticket Master take all the money and the artist gets shit.

Great musicians to this day still get discovered and still have their freedom of making what they want, mostly what you see in the Metal genre as well as some pop artists like Lady Ga Ga(I know so many hate her). Many of these artists are also starting to walk away form there major labels and going independent in order to do what they want, that is why Manson is no longer with Nothing INterscope