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Tekken 7 General Discussion Thread - OP Updated With All Tekken Info

WidowPuppy

Attack pekingese
Who are the top 5 scariest characters at the wall?
Have to put some thought into that, especially not being too familiar with the new characters. But I do believe a good Asuka can be scary at the wall because her parry can lead to a splat. However, with no bound... not sure what she'd get that would be optimal after the splat in T7.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Have to put some thought into that, especially not being too familiar with the new characters. But I do believe a good Asuka can be scary at the wall because her parry can lead to a splat. However, with no bound... not sure what she'd get that would be optimal after the splat in T7.
I edited my past post, check it out :p

Top 5 wall pressure features Heihachi and Jin IMO, no matter what the new characters bring to the table.
Yeah heihachi is good too, but he has been too nerfed in this game.
 

Smoke_Of_Finland

Believe in the hop kick
I edited my past post, check it out :p


Yeah heihachi is good too, but he has been too nerfed in this game.
I haven't seen much Heihachi gameplay, most of the frames on RB Norway for T7 seem to be the same, ws1 has been changed from -13 to -14 and 2nd low on hellsweep series is listed unsafe with a question mark, however cd4,1 was changed to -12 while cd1 by itself is still -15. I have seen JDCR end wall combos with df1,2 and it seems to give a guaranteed d3... that means Raijin stance 2,1 could potentially also allow a guaranteed d3 and there are a couple of wall splatting moves that allow to pull off a RS 2,1 follow-up.
 

Smoke_Of_Finland

Believe in the hop kick
It's more that Tekken 3 and 5 are considered more impressive based on the standards of when they were released. So, for instance, Tekken 3 was considered a lot more impressive compared to other games made in 1997-1998 when viewed in line with how Tekken 6 was considered compared to other games from 2007-2009. Don't forget that Tekken 3 was also one of the first 3D fighting games to feature universal and more importantly fluid 3-dimensional movement (other 3D fighting games with sidesteps tended to be very clunky in this regard)

And tbh, I don't think there's too much to worry about in terms of Tekken 7's future. Honestly, my biggest worry is that training mode will end up being lacklustre again. There really is no good reason not to include frame data in-game, as multiple other fighting games do it these days, and Tekken is the sort of game where you really need to know that stuff ultra well to have any chance of getting good.
Not having in-game frame data is simply Harada's choice, he feels like it takes away from the depth of the game to include it in the practice mode.

http://www.avoidingthepuddle.com/news/2014/2/4/harada-on-revealing-frame-data-in-tekken-games.html

It is what it is, just gotta check RB Norway for frames and/or test what comes to mind in practice mode. To some extent, Harada is right. People could be too quick to dismiss or not test certain things for themselves if the frames are handed out. For newer players this decision obviously sucks complete and utter ass as they have no legacy knowledge and the grind might put them off from getting into Tekken.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
I haven't seen much Heihachi gameplay, most of the frames on RB Norway for T7 seem to be the same, ws1 has been changed from -13 to -14 and 2nd low on hellsweep series is listed unsafe with a question mark, however cd4,1 was changed to -12 while cd1 by itself is still -15. I have seen JDCR end wall combos with df1,2 and it seems to give a guaranteed d3... that means Raijin stance 2,1 could potentially also allow a guaranteed d3 and there are a couple of wall splatting moves that allow to pull off a RS 2,1 follow-up.
That's true, the hellsweep second hit if blocked is now launch punishable, that is why you see way less now.

Knee has been playing a lot of heihachi recently, even his combos are different from JDCR, i've been resting from tekken footage for a while because i don't wanna be sad again, but seeing heihachi play is such a breath of fresh air, i will see what he has to offer at the wall, but as far as i know, the hellsweep nerf was too heavy on the oldman.
 

WidowPuppy

Attack pekingese
I edited my past post, check it out :p


Yeah heihachi is good too, but he has been too nerfed in this game.
All good info and valid choices. Haven't played TTT2 in a while and will need to warm up my movement prior to T7 FR 6.0 Trolled you console kids to death edition. Then my lack of overall Tekken experience will come into play [TTT2 being my first Tekken]. Can't wait to get bodied by you vets, if you guys won't mind beating up a scrub. Will only make me stronger.

Fucking Jin in T7!
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
All good info and valid choices. Haven't played TTT2 in a while and will need to warm up my movement prior to T7 FR 6.0 Trolled you console kids to death edition. Then my lack of overall Tekken experience will come into play [TTT2 being my first Tekken]. Can't wait to get bodied by you vets, if you guys won't mind beating up a scrub. Will only make me stronger.

Fucking Jin in T7!
I'm no vet either, i just have a good eye for this sort of things, TTT2 was my first competitive Tekken, i only intend to grow from there, my path as a competitive player started here on TYM, but i've been playing any fighting game i used to with a different mindset.

Since MK9 i've played.
TTT2 (Jin, Kuni, this year i explored more the mishimas.)

USF4 (Ibuki, E.Ryu, Decapre)
Mahvel
VF5 (Akira)
DOA (Akira) never spent too much time with the game though.
MKX

Up next
SF5
T7

So i guess i've learned a lot playing other fighting games.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
BTW, i'm playing DMC4 Special Edition, Trish is the coolest new character in terms of gameplay design, she is so different from the other demons yet so unique.
 

Smoke_Of_Finland

Believe in the hop kick
That's true, the hellsweep second hit if blocked is now launch punishable, that is why you see way less now.

Knee has been playing a lot of heihachi recently, even his combos are different from JDCR, i've been resting from tekken footage for a while because i don't wanna be sad again, but seeing heihachi play is such a breath of fresh air, i will see what he has to offer at the wall, but as far as i know, the hellsweep nerf was too heavy on the oldman.
Yeah, the hellsweep nerf is kinda pointless. Better players will just duck the 2nd hit most of the time anyway and the dragon uppercut follow-up being not launch punishable is just a bad trade off. The way I used Hei's hellsweep was very seldom and generally just go for the 2nd low to see if my opponent is on point with his blocking, but now to play any mind games with Hei's hellsweep you just gotta use it too much, cd4,1 wallsplats and allows a Raijin stance 2,1 follow-up but you still gotta connect the 1st hellsweep to even get a chance for the mix-up. Now the hellsweep-series is pretty much almost as bad and risky as Bryan's snake edge or Feng's db4.
 

buyacushun

Normalize grab immunity.
Who are the top 5 scariest characters at the wall?

Here is my top 5 picks.

#5 Paul
Come on, if you don't have Paul on your top 5 deadliest characters at the wall in the game, you must be nuts, Paul has a death fist that deals clean damage, AND wallsplats, besides being a good W! move, its also the most stupid ender ever on any situation including WALLS. This is just the beginning you so don't want to get hit by death fist that which will conditions you to stand block against him in order to avoid it.

Guess what, paul has a throw which also wallsplat when you're blocking standing, and a d4,2 also will wall splat on on counter only, although besides all this, he has very few tracking moves so you can sidestep while you can, just be carefull with his magic 4.

4# Kazuya
Kazuya wall game wasn't much of a scarier before in TTT2, but in T7 he got some decent buffs to cop-out his lack of wall damage, he got Devil Jin's B4 move which hits mid, on counter hit it causes crumple stun, but against he wall, it will splat.
That move is stupid good because is safe and puts you under some serious pressure since you don't want to duck to not get hit by it, it will constantly put you under pressure with F4 which also hits mid but causes knockdown.

The problem is, F4 on block will frame trap you, which leave Kazuya to try out some interesting offense with his other tools, even though is 112 doesn't wallsplats anymore, i dare you press a button after you block F4, just press and find out what happens.
Scrub though: "maybe i should take the hit"
Suuuure! Just be mindful that on counter hit will knockdown and guarantees a free B4 luckly doesn't wallsplat, but the guaranteed damage of this two moves is insane which btw is also part of his consistent wall combo.

Any BnB into df14 then F4, B4 when they hit the wall and do some stupid damage.
Don't forget he still has hellsweep which will surely wall splat, so will you block a hellsweep on reaction you will take the hit?

3# Devil Jin
Saltshaker nows what's up, if you haven't seen the last tekken video i've shared among a few pages ago, where Devil Jin is doing ridiculous stuff at the wall, his wall game is so dumb that you will cry for the person taking the hit.
He has a stone head that wall splats, Laser cannon mixups which can be delayed, last hits wall splats, he can delay for a stone head, B4 or Hellsweep, he has so many fast attacks that are so impredictable to react to them on point

On situations like this one, usually it feels like devil jin is saying, "pick a winner" either you risk your entire life and dare to press a button, or die in the wall.

2# King
I put king on my number two list for several reasons first up, King has a good chunk of mid moves , attacks that crushes other attacks those will keep anyone honest on the wall willing to not press to many buttons, and this leads to my personal favorite, he has throws that wall splat.
U+1+2~b will change the direction of the throw and reverse positions with king, and he earns a wallsplat in the process when he is against the wall, its a 1+2 break so it should be easier right? Well, now picture for a second that king has another throw called Giant Swing, which cannot be teched on the same window than regular throws, if you miss the window you're done, if you guess the wrong break, your done. You're getting wallsplated bruh.

And as if it wasn't worse, he has a wall throw which will make you cry, because when it finishes, he gets to do things you never imagine, like throw you on a wakeup, or if he reads a techroll he can pick you up to not let you reposition on the wall or his new Netsu setup is also scarier.


1# Jin Kazama
One of the reasons why Jin has always managed to hold it on his own, it was because how ridiculous he is at the wall, if any Jin masters his wall game, every time you do a corner carry your likely to win the round.

In Tekken 7 his wall game is even better, considering he has very consistent wall enders, his half of his fillers, strings and a few normals are designed to wallsplat, if you think death fist is dumb, wait until you find out that Jin has a 50-50 mixup at the wall.

He has tracking moves that wallsplat, so sidestep mindlessly is out of the question, his low starters got a bit nerfed since there is no bound, but that is the whole point, you will want to block those lows at the wall since the constant knockdown into d2 will do very good damage, so you will be risking to duck, even if it is just for a brief moment.
Problem is that he has a bunch of safe a 13f mid which can lead to wallsplat with tracking, and is safe, a ff2 that is safe and wallsplats, a B4 that wall splat and is safe, ff3 that frame traps, EWHF and now recently a sidestep attack that crumple stun on counter hit, which guarantes a "median line destruction aka 1+2" which will wallsplat afterwards and he still has parry.

Half of the games of Jin i've seen either Korea or Japan, hell, even my games, were all done once Jin got their opponent cornered against the wall, there isn't much you can do about it other than guess right on a low or mid and block it, if you side step you die, before you could counter, but now you can't even do counters because uf2 is the new "scrub" move as some dude on the Tekken community said "just spam that move to win" lol

F'ing Jin in Tekken 7 man.
The scary part is the fact I'm sure someone could come up with some other characters deserving a top 5 spot and even more characters are scary enough at the wall too. I've been watching matches and any time I see a combo end against the wall I pray for the player getting up.
 

Smoke_Of_Finland

Believe in the hop kick
The universal changes to the game system hurt Heihachi a bit. Other characters got good buffs to compensate, their designated power crush moves are better, lost okizeme options were also compensated for by adding more CH launchers and damage and just generally buffing lows. If his designated power crush df1+2 is still -16 on block then there is still no reason to ever use that move. Db1+2 will dodge almost all mids and power crushes get beat by lows anyway. Uf4 doesn't put the opponent into tailspin state on normal hit. In TTT2 Heihachi and Devil Jin do not have access to a delayed hop kick like Kazuya does. Devil Jin doesn't need it, but this buff alone would make Heihachi's ankles not as free. Being able to tailspin after a low parry is actually one of the few changes that greatly benefit him, I'd be really pleased if he got more than 45 points from a low parry.
 
Who are the top 5 scariest characters at the wall?

Here is my top 5 picks.

#5 Paul
Come on, if you don't have Paul on your top 5 deadliest characters at the wall in the game, you must be nuts, Paul has a death fist that deals clean damage, AND wallsplats, besides being a good W! move, its also the most stupid ender ever on any situation including WALLS. This is just the beginning you so don't want to get hit by death fist that which will conditions you to stand block against him in order to avoid it.

Guess what, paul has a throw which also wallsplat when you're blocking standing, and a d4,2 also will wall splat on on counter only, although besides all this, he has very few tracking moves so you can sidestep while you can, just be carefull with his magic 4.

4# Kazuya
Kazuya wall game wasn't much of a scarier before in TTT2, but in T7 he got some decent buffs to cop-out his lack of wall damage, he got Devil Jin's B4 move which hits mid, on counter hit it causes crumple stun, but against he wall, it will splat.
That move is stupid good because is safe and puts you under some serious pressure since you don't want to duck to not get hit by it, it will constantly put you under pressure with F4 which also hits mid but causes knockdown.

The problem is, F4 on block will frame trap you, which leave Kazuya to try out some interesting offense with his other tools, even though is 112 doesn't wallsplats anymore, i dare you press a button after you block F4, just press and find out what happens.
Scrub though: "maybe i should take the hit"
Suuuure! Just be mindful that on counter hit will knockdown and guarantees a free B4 luckly doesn't wallsplat, but the guaranteed damage of this two moves is insane which btw is also part of his consistent wall combo.

Any BnB into df14 then F4, B4 when they hit the wall and do some stupid damage.
Don't forget he still has hellsweep which will surely wall splat, so will you block a hellsweep on reaction you will take the hit?

3# Devil Jin
Saltshaker nows what's up, if you haven't seen the last tekken video i've shared among a few pages ago, where Devil Jin is doing ridiculous stuff at the wall, his wall game is so dumb that you will cry for the person taking the hit.
He has a stone head that wall splats, Laser cannon mixups which can be delayed, last hits wall splats, he can delay for a stone head, B4 or Hellsweep, he has so many fast attacks that are so impredictable to react to them on point

On situations like this one, usually it feels like devil jin is saying, "pick a winner" either you risk your entire life and dare to press a button, or die in the wall.

2# King
I put king on my number two list for several reasons first up, King has a good chunk of mid moves , attacks that crushes other attacks those will keep anyone honest on the wall willing to not press to many buttons, and this leads to my personal favorite, he has throws that wall splat.
U+1+2~b will change the direction of the throw and reverse positions with king, and he earns a wallsplat in the process when he is against the wall, its a 1+2 break so it should be easier right? Well, now picture for a second that king has another throw called Giant Swing, which cannot be teched on the same window than regular throws, if you miss the window you're done, if you guess the wrong break, your done. You're getting wallsplated bruh.

And as if it wasn't worse, he has a wall throw which will make you cry, because when it finishes, he gets to do things you never imagine, like throw you on a wakeup, or if he reads a techroll he can pick you up to not let you reposition on the wall or his new Netsu setup is also scarier.


1# Jin Kazama
One of the reasons why Jin has always managed to hold it on his own, it was because how ridiculous he is at the wall, if any Jin masters his wall game, every time you do a corner carry your likely to win the round.

In Tekken 7 his wall game is even better, considering he has very consistent wall enders, his half of his fillers, strings and a few normals are designed to wallsplat, if you think death fist is dumb, wait until you find out that Jin has a 50-50 mixup at the wall.

He has tracking moves that wallsplat, so sidestep mindlessly is out of the question, his low starters got a bit nerfed since there is no bound, but that is the whole point, you will want to block those lows at the wall since the constant knockdown into d2 will do very good damage, so you will be risking to duck, even if it is just for a brief moment.
Problem is that he has a bunch of safe a 13f mid which can lead to wallsplat with tracking, and is safe, a ff2 that is safe and wallsplats, a B4 that wall splat and is safe, ff3 that frame traps, EWHF and now recently a sidestep attack that crumple stun on counter hit, which guarantes a "median line destruction aka 1+2" which will wallsplat afterwards and he still has parry.

Half of the games of Jin i've seen either Korea or Japan, hell, even my games, were all done once Jin got their opponent cornered against the wall, there isn't much you can do about it other than guess right on a low or mid and block it, if you side step you die, before you could counter, but now you can't even do counters because uf2 is the new "scrub" move as some dude on the Tekken community said "just spam that move to win" lol

F'ing Jin in Tekken 7 man.
Totally agree with that list, the only thing is that why would you block low against Paul lol
 

buyacushun

Normalize grab immunity.
Do movement options differentiate between characters? Is Lili's side step faster and farther than King's? Does Law jump or run faster than Kazuya?
 
That's a sick joke no matter how you look at it.
Even though it may not feel like it right now, I reckon it's for the best. They don't want their release to totally clash with Street Fighter 5, after all.


Do movement options differentiate between characters? Is Lili's side step faster and farther than King's? Does Law jump or run faster than Kazuya?
Sidesteps varying in distance is definitely a thing, as is distance on stuff like backdashing, but AFAIK everyone jumps the same height and runs the same speed.
 

buyacushun

Normalize grab immunity.
Even though it may not feel like it right now, I reckon it's for the best. They don't want their release to totally clash with Street Fighter 5, after all.
That I can get but Tekken 7 has been out way before SFV lol. I don't expect it to come now. But anytime during the previous year would of worked. Casuals stay with fighters for only a few months. So they wouldn't have to worry about killing anyone else's initial profits. But now we got to wait until whoever has control deems consoles are ready for TEKKEN 7 ("Tekken" looks so much better in ALL CAPS.)

Sidesteps varying in distance is definitely a thing, as is distance on stuff like backdashing, but AFAIK everyone jumps the same height and runs the same speed.
Thanks. Are there any weird things with the different blockstun animations and walls and other variables that can happen? I know in MKx in some cases it's better to block either standing or crouching.