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Breakthrough - Balanced RIP Kenshi. Why Balanced is Bottom 5 in MKX and it's a shame.

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
some of your suggestion were find but others are kind of "broken" like making ex Rk +6 on block :eek:

i agree that kenshi is one of the weakest characters as of now in the game but he is alse very tricky to buff. i am sure that nrs do not want him to be able to do what he was able to do in mk9 to like 80% of the cast.

there is a way to buff kenshi so that he is very very good without making him win every matchup 8-2 lol but i really don't think nrs would make that move to bad
I'll tag u when ashenar and I post our suggestions
 

STRYKIE

Are ya' ready for MK11 kids?!
F2, B4, in ninjutsu and 11 breaks it as well. Hell, you can do a s1 into a MB'd teleport for punish and armor break.
Okay, well I don't think a Scorpion player would use Ninjutsu for Kenshi, but you confirmed my suspicions. Ninjutsu's B4 can stuff any armored move. F2 stuffs all except 6 frame moves (well maybe it does and I just haven't found the sweet spot yet), and 11/12 stuffs moves 12 frames upwards given that he's at adequate advantage frames.

That's not really a problem for Kenshi in particular, that's just Ninjutsu being Ninjutsu. Otherwise characters like Kung Lao should be considered to have bad armor, which is clearly crazy talk.
 

DarksydeDash

You know me as RisingShieldBro online.
Okay, well I don't think a Scorpion player would use Ninjutsu for Kenshi, but you confirmed my suspicions. Ninjutsu's B4 can stuff any armored move. F2 stuffs all except 6 frame moves (well maybe it does and I just haven't found the sweet spot yet), and 11/12 stuffs moves 12 frames upwards given that he's at adequate advantage frames.

That's not really a problem for Kenshi in particular, that's just Ninjutsu being Ninjutsu. Otherwise characters like Kung Lao should be considered to have bad armor, which is clearly crazy talk.
Most will use Ninjutsu against kenshi because on reaction you can easily b2 after a neutral ducked tele-flurry or when you see a Tele-slice above you. Don't forget he also has a teleport >.<
 

Schuyler

Noob
SF Sonya bottom 5? Coming from someone who said Reptile was low mid just because of his damage I'm not surprised. Just like Cassie and Shinnok are low mid as well because both of them barely get past 30% damage midscreen.

It's hilarious the amount of people who basically joined TYM yesterday with more posts than some who have been around here for years, because I believe new members have more than enough free time to make bullshit posts like these.
what makes sonya special ops good lol? And reptile is universally known to be mid low. Cassie basically now has a meter less vortex and can get 50% in the corner off one bar plus its an overhead. she can get an easy one bar 46% whats reptiles 1 bar damnge like in the corner? With reptile you need a bar of meter to do any sort of respectable damage. Its funny how we've already been over this and now you say some more bull shit damage isn't the only thing that matters but its very important. Shinnok cassie and tanya make up for it in different ways and this is common sense.
 

Schuyler

Noob
Lol you try taking balanced to tournament see how it works. I'm not wanting kenshi to be broken. I WANT HIM TO BE VIABLE, you don't know Jack shit about the struggles of maining this dude. I can't use half the tools I have or what I get full combo punished from ANYWHERE. Balanced kenshi is a scrub killer, he pets
Preys on those who don't know shit about the match up. Who actually RESPECT kenshis zoning, kenshis zoning when is not respected will blow him the fuck up. Kenshi is bottom 5 easy, I play lasher as a secondary. He is MILES better than balanced kenshi. I fucked around and played a lot of unstoppable. Once again MILES ahead. Jaqui recently got buffed and can get in on kenshi EASY, literally anyone in the game can get in easy on kenshi is they know the match up. I'm not downplaying. I'm being a realist. I WISH I could up play kenshi. I tried for a certain amount of time, I JUST CAN'T he is horribad.
Your defiantly downplaying saying kenshi is worse than lasher lol. I dont main kenshi cause hes boring to me i was intrested in him when I was 7 now not so much. Ive learned him. Go ahead and keep crying all 3 of kenshis variations are viable. If not balanced than the other 2 for sure.
 

Schuyler

Noob
Here we go again living in the past. Welcome to 2015 we play a game called mkx. I can see by the avatar you've heard about it. 2011 called it wants its mule to stop getting beat by people like you.
You people are the one living in the past hoping and praying your charter will live up to his mk9 counter part but no your charter is actually fair this time around get over it. Kenshi has 2 together perfectly fine variations to use.
 

Schuyler

Noob
Lol.

You can stand block the overhead slash on reaction and then run in for pressure afterwards. You really must have no idea how balanced Kenshi works if you think he's good.

Spec ops sonya is also not bottom 5. Seriously, it's like you have no idea how the game works.

I don't play Jason, but I heard the patch addressed a lot of his whiffing mids.
Well it actually didn't. One of his mids now hit as an actual mid. Most of the useful ones can be low profiled by most of the cast. You can do nothing but hit jason with down 4s and he wouldn't be able to do anything about it. Kenshi is viable and so are his other variations.
 

STRYKIE

Are ya' ready for MK11 kids?!
Most will use Ninjutsu against kenshi because on reaction you can easily b2 after a neutral ducked tele-flurry or when you see a Tele-slice above you. Don't forget he also has a teleport >.<
Fishing for a whiff punish isn't really what you should be using Ninjutsu for. And let's make something clear, if you've been B2'd out of a Overhead Slice, it wasn't on reaction. Hellfire and Inferno already do well enough to stop Kenshi from being Kenshi IMO.

So yeah, I'm still not buying armor being a problem for Kenshi, especially when you line it up with mine.... lol.
 
Why do I keep hearing people say "now they can " COMPETE
Read through pretty much the whole thread and I am not here to argue cuz I have seen some atrocious buff suggestions and statements but I will skip past that. All I am going to say is that I think balanced is still his best variation and I for sure dnt think it is bottom 5 in the game. Also I do not want to hear (oh MIT why don't u go place with him) that needs to stop for real. @FOREVER KING could place with goro, doesn't mean he is good.
Where do you put balanced then? If anyone has a teleport they can punish a TF anywhere on the screen. I just can't see y he wouldn't be bottom 5 with having such limited tools and no mixup game and no pressure. Even if you don't think bottom 5 for whatever reason, he is GARBAGE compared to so many people in the game.
 

Ashenar

Just a slightly above average player.....
You people are the one living in the past hoping and praying your charter will live up to his mk9 counter part but no your charter is actually fair this time around get over it. Kenshi has 2 together perfectly fine variations to use.
LoL just lol
 

errormacro7

Official Sonya simp
what makes sonya special ops good lol? And reptile is universally known to be mid low. Cassie basically now has a meter less vortex and can get 50% in the corner off one bar plus its an overhead. she can get an easy one bar 46% whats reptiles 1 bar damnge like in the corner? With reptile you need a bar of meter to do any sort of respectable damage. Its funny how we've already been over this and now you say some more bull shit damage isn't the only thing that matters but its very important. Shinnok cassie and tanya make up for it in different ways and this is common sense.
Special *Forces. It's time for Cassie players to learn the difference.

And I'm done with this. You're dumb af. lol
 

HuttonMD

ADM Riddles
Why would I be salty and your the ones crying about a perfectly fine character ?
Who's crying? Like I said before I Dont play the character so IDC either way but you act like everyone wants a god mode kenshi but they just want viable zoning designed for how mkx is played
 

EntropicByDesign

It's all so very confusing.
The simple fact of the matter is NRS have little to no idea what they're doing. I'm not claiming I do, but I can see broken-tier characters plainly enough, and so can most people if they wipe the salt out of their eyes long enough to take an OBJECTIVE look at whats in front of them. I don't even play Kenshi.. I wanted to, but I suck at this game and the struggle was too much for me. NRS should have a huge amount of data at their disposal now that they should be able to use to reasonably balance the game.. and now is the time to do it.

I know a lot of people say they don't want more changes, let the game breathe, but my counter to that is.. Why? This is early in the games life, now is when we should have changes and there are numerous characters and variations that *really* need changes. I feel like you do one of two things, large, landslide changes put out aggressively and often, early, then a 'lock-in' where you say 'ok, thats it, it is what it is. We will revisit blah blah after blah blah amount of time' OR you do scheduled changes, spread out over a longer period of time and make the changes small. Nothing that heavily shifts the game, but gradual changes, and you watch how things evolve. (I dont think fighting games lend themselves super well to this style).

Additionally, people saying the game needs to breathe, I think, are looking a little more at how things played out once upon a time. The argument is 'Well, people discover this and that and new stuff pops up months and even years down the road etc' . This certainly is true, but its not exactly that simple.

First and most importantly, the amount and delivery of information is exponentially greater than it was just a couple years ago. Competitive games today have MUCH larger player bases than they ever did before and those players are far more vocal. How many people were streaming and producing youtube content a year ago vs today? I'll bet the increase is MASSIVE. This means the chances of tech or dirt going undiscovered (or more specifically, un-broadcast) is much lower than it used to be. Dirty tricks and crazy setups that may have taken a community months to parse and discover once upon a time, now are rooted out and put on display by any number of YouTubers or Streamers, all hungry for views. The age of hidden tech is dying. You can tune in to a pros stream in almost any game at almost any hour. Once we had to wait for tournaments to see a pro play and try to cram down our throats all the knowledge they threw out during the competition, then assimilate it and so on.. Now, its a cinch you can Twitch or YouTube countless hours of high level play. This all causes games to age more aggressively and all the ins and out to be dug out and put on display MUCH faster.

Secondly, the quality of players has increased a great deal. The younger guys, in most instances, have gamed more than most of us older crowd did when we were the same age. So as they step in to new games they have a large and likely diverse background with games in general. That goes a long way when it comes to parsing the systems within a game and how they act avt and react to one another. And the older guys.. well, theyve been around a long ass time. How many of the MKX pros are brand new vs old school pros coming from one, two, three or more other fighting games? That kind of background and knowledge base means the well schooled pros can pick apart a character and just what that character can and cant do, very very quickly. The quality of opposition being what it is, it also means they cant afford to sandbag and hide tech, so when they play, we see what they've got. Sure, some stuff does slip through, Quans double portal thingy comes immediately to mind, but these sorts of things are NO WHERE near as common as they once were and if someone does discover something juicy, even if they don't openly share it, its a guarantee that the first time they use it it'll be noticed, picked up and passed along by any number of keen-eyed players.

Dont get me wrong, I feel like the last patch did some good work (and some bullshit.. Im looking at you Kano) but.. that doesnt matter to Kenshi, who took it in his blind little bum.

This thread is about Kenshi, if *insert character and variation here* sucks, I feel for you, I do. I would LOVE all Characters to be viable, but just because you feel like your character still didnt get what he/she needed, that doesnt make Kenshi;s problems any less of a thing and when a Kenshi player is putting in work and outplaying his opponent, making the right reads and doing his job as a player,. but still getting shit on by a character thats just spamming dirt over and over (loooooots of characters), that player, while sailing through the air and being full combo punished from full screen, isnt likely to say to himself "Ya know, this utter bullshit is ok, because I'll bet some other characters might suck even more than me, and fucking Quan Chi, he didnt even get armor!"

Also, saying Kenshi was strong in MK9 and this is punishment.. I assume most of you are joking, but if your serious, and that is your actual thought process.. Go chew on some roofing nails.

Here's a little experiment you can do at home to help illustrate how stupid the 'others have it worse' excuse is. Grab a loved one, and a hammer. Now! Smash two-three of their fingers with said hammer, then, while they scream and cry and babble, smash your own fingers with the hammer, only make it one fewer. So, if you took three of theirs, only take two of yours. Then lift up your hand with the jagged bone splinters and annihilated finger joints, grab your controller and go lab for about an hour. It shouldnt be a problem right? I mean, THEY have it worse than you, so you should have NO TROUBLE WHATSOEVER using your hand. It shouldnt hurt, nor should it hinder you, 'cause they are hurting worse, there-by erasing all your own issues.

Once that's done, grab the loved one whos hand you broke, and a gas can, cover yourself in gas and have said loved one light you on fire. This will serve two purposes, by your own logic, the first reason is your loved one will no longer be in any pain or suffer any inconvenience from the injuries you gave them because you are hurting more than they are now. The second reason, and arguably the most important, is you doing so will save the rest of the people on this website who have the ability to think and reason things out objectively and logically a few extra brain cells that they would have otherwise lost having to suffer through more of the brain-vomit you call a post.
 

VladMkd

Noob
Even playing possessed can feel so linear at times doing a string into a high or low special which is his only mix up game. I think It would be cool if Ex Db1 threw them upwards so you can njp combo instead of the boring 18% you have to do every time (outside of corner). Also his teleport game isn't threatening at all cause his close game is shit. What if they let you teleport in the air or be able to dictate your teleport to either go in front or behind them to stop easy aa's? There just doesn't feel iike there is much creativity in his kit and forces you to play a specific way which isn't great to begin with. Also I'm tired of doing bf3 and having the opponent just run right through to full combo punish me full screen.