MY PREDICTIONS FOR THE NEXT BALANCE PATCH - POST YOURS

[Brown Cow 54]

The only thing that could have any affect on his other variation would be making Electrocute more negative on block since currently he can make B33 more safe without the use of meter from -17 currently to -7. But if you want safe 50/50s and teleports/lighting traps, you should be willing to get off of a bar to use Vicinity Burst to make it safe. So you need to make that choice, do you want a meterless, safe option in your 50/50 in Thunder God, or do you want the benefits of his other variations.

Only thing is it isn't safe. It's a high.

 

[GLoRToR]

Ultimately some characters need buffs and others need nerfs to strike a balance.

Finally somebody sees my point.

 

[PandaManee]

Only thing is it isn't safe. It's a high.

When u cancel it from a move you block it regardless, so its safe.....

 

[PandaManee]

Finally somebody sees my point.

I agree some characters need buff... But this tread is about nerfs :3

 

[qspec]

I don't think you full understand the OS

Then please explain it.

As I understand it, your general OS in this game is dependent on the fact that the on-hit window is different than the on-block window. To add to that, if you input a direction, it "washes" your special cancel.

In most cases, both are used. For example, Mileena has a safe low on block or a roll on hit by doing the following (I'm at work, so hopefully my moves and combos are correct):
F12 > Roll > B4 On hit, the Roll comes out during the on-hit window. On block, the B washes the Roll and allows the rest of the safe combo to come out.

I'm not familiar with Raiden's OSs, but I'm guessing it is similar? For example, B2 > DF2 > F so the DF2 comes out on hit, but the F washes the input during the on-block window so it doesn't come out on block.

Yes?

 

[Qwark28]

-His 2-11 string seems to anti air everything
.

It trip guards.

 

[PandaManee]

Then please explain it.

As I understand it, your general OS in this game is dependent on the fact that the on-hit window is different than the on-block window. To add to that, if you input a direction, it "washes" your special cancel.

In most cases, both are used. For example, Mileena has a safe low on block or a roll on hit by doing the following (I'm at work, so hopefully my moves and combos are correct):
F12 > Roll > B4 On hit, the Roll comes out during the on-hit window. On block, the B washes the Roll and allows the rest of the safe combo to come out.

I'm not familiar with Raiden's OSs, but I'm guessing it is similar? For example, B2 > DF2 > F so the DF2 comes out on hit, but the F washes the input during the on-block window so it doesn't come out on block.

Yes?

Oh yea you could do that too. I used to get it with Jacqui .. I edited my previous post explaining the one i was talking about

 

[SEV]

Only thing is it isn't safe. It's a high.

It also jails on block from the overhead OS, so it doesn't matter if it can be ducked in other scenarios. And either way you only are only further proving my point. If it can be ducked then it being more negative on block wouldn't affect him at all, since he would be whiff punished anyways...

 

[Take$$$]

I would just tone down Dvorahs F44 damage scaling. Getting around 40% meterless and 50% with a bar is way too much for all the tools she has.

Eh, the 38% meterless midscreen is unsafe and only works on dudes. She also still gets close to those numbers without multiple f44s, so balancing gets tricky. If they take away a chunk of her damage on everything, some help in the wakeup area would be nice.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Eh, the 38% meterless midscreen is unsafe and only works on dudes. She also still gets close to those numbers without multiple f44s, so balancing gets tricky. If they take away a chunk of her damage on everything, some help in the wakeup area would be nice.

If you give a good wakeup you take away one of her only weaknesses. And what combo doesnt use f44 that does the same amount of damage as the F44 ones?

 

[Take$$$]

If you give a good wakeup you take away one of her only weaknesses. And what combo doesnt use f44 that does the same amount of damage as the F44 ones?

Not asking for good wakeup, but if her damage takes a significant hit then she might end up needing help there. Just making f44 scale harder isn't gonna lower her damage by a significant amount, unless they really wanna hit her overall damage and make the first f44 scale hard af. I also said multiple f44s. Some guy found a 36%-37% meterless midscreen using only one f44, so I used that to find a 1 meter 45%-46%. I'm sure someone more imaginative than me could get more from something like that too.

 

[PandaManee]

Kung Laos Tempest damage is kind of insane now he can get about 43% meterless of his 12 frame F2 .....

 

[Helter Skelter]

The only real thing Raiden needs adjusting is making F+1 a High instead of Mid. People don't realise how much that would actually balance out that attack.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Not asking for good wakeup, but if her damage takes a significant hit then she might end up needing help there. Just making f44 scale harder isn't gonna lower her damage by a significant amount, unless they really wanna hit her overall damage and make the first f44 scale hard af. I also said multiple f44s. Some guy found a 36%-37% meterless midscreen using only one f44, so I used that to find a 1 meter 45%-46%. I'm sure someone more imaginative than me could get more from something like that too.

I was talking scale F44 in general, which would include the first F44. Not sure what they would give her in the wakeup department, as her backdash is pretty good for lots of situations. Maybe make EX swarm vortex armored? That sounds broken though lol

 

[haketh]

I was talking scale F44 in general, which would include the first F44. Not sure what they would give her in the wakeup department, as her backdash is pretty good for lots of situations. Maybe make EX swarm vortex armored? That sounds broken though lol

She doesn't need any more or less armor. Her having vulernable wake up if she wants to do anything other than block is fine.

 

[Zoidberg747]

She doesn't need any more or less armor. Her having vulernable wake up if she wants to do anything other than block is fine.

Yeah I agree.

 

[TheJaquio]

The option selects need to go. I say start there universally. And for Raiden, making f12 -5 is reasonable in order to address the pseudo block infinites on some characters. However, it really needs to stop there. It's important to take baby steps and see how single changes affect the character's overall gameplay, before continuing to tweak their balance. Throwing four or five nerfs at a character simultaneously is reactionary and rushed, no matter how reasonable the nerfs seem.

 

[Take$$$]

I was talking scale F44 in general, which would include the first F44. Not sure what they would give her in the wakeup department, as her backdash is pretty good for lots of situations. Maybe make EX swarm vortex armored? That sounds broken though lol

Yeah but I meant they would have to make the first one scale harder than any f44s after it. Armored swarm vortex sounds bleh, for some reason it has a longer startup than the normal version so it'd be easy to break. Ex db4 being faster with less recovery would be nice, or an entirely new special could be cool since they've shown they're willing to do that. But again thats only if they hit her damage hard, otherwise if she only loses a percent or two then she'd be fine.

Tbh I like her current design, which is high damage, high pressure but can be completely free for most of the cast if you knock her down once. However I can see how that can be bad to have in the game, so they would need to fix both sides of it if they want it gone.

Another nerf idea instead of nerfing damage, is just make her 1 a lot slower so she can't reliably full combo punish stuff for 36%. I don't know how I feel about that one though.

 

[Chris Friday]

Kung Laos Tempest damage is kind of insane now he can get about 43% meterless of his 12 frame F2 .....

I feel that NRS gave tempest big damage to make up for his lack of mixups. Fighting against tempest, the opponent will never have to worry about high low mixups at all. Also his big damage combos are not that easy to do.

 

[EndofGameBoss]

I wonder if these threads will pop up after every tournament...

Anyway, I feel removing option selects would help a lot. Nerfing his f12 string too much could make for a disaster. Slightly buffing some characters pokes would do the trick. He would still be able to apply pressure with f1, f12b2, but can be poked on block.

 

[Cerebru]

If Raiden gets to keep his electrocute safe I want Johnny's shadow kick the same. The same frames on block adv.
Why shouldn't I be able to end all my bad reads in a safe move and not give a shit about the opponent as well?

Shadow Kick is just like super man.... would you want me to superman you from full screen and start pressure.

 

[PandaManee]

I feel that NRS gave tempest big damage to make up for his lack of mixups. Fighting against tempest, the opponent will never have to worry about high low mixups at all. Also his big damage combos are not that easy to do.

From punishing anything to punishing like a beast! lol

 

[PandaManee]

How about Erron Black?? That tick throw set up is pretty strong and he already has 50/50s otherwise....... Where the Erron mains?

 

[M.D.]

Shadow Kick is just like super man.... would you want me to superman you from full screen and start pressure.

It's a high. It would be the same as NightWolf in MK9. Which was safe.

 

[Zoidberg747]

Shadow Kick is just like super man.... would you want me to superman you from full screen and start pressure.

Superman carries farther on the screen and leaves them closer than shadow kick. Nice try though.