General/Other - Kotal Kahn Kotal Kahn General Discussion

[Hassun]

Just bringing this all up to say that I think War God will stay playable at a high level as time goes on. He's not the very top, for sure, but he is competitive and will likely remain so.

I'd say War God is mid and Blood/Sun are low. I think War God is currently punching slightly above his weight.

 

[GAV]

I just hate Kung Jin. Its just stupid how easy he is to play. I spent no time in practice mode with him and can do 40 consistently without meter and off high priority starters that outrange all pokes.

Other than Kung Jin, the characters seem well balanced to me.

 

[Ben Reed]

Any threads or videos on War God oki options yet? (specifically, safe jumps?) I took a quick look through the back pages of the forum but didn't see anything jump out aside from a few Sun Ray gimmicks, TheAqua's b32 corner wakeup baits, and D.R.'s ground pound reset which was pretty cool.

What other characters are good at playing the mid-range footsie/whiff punish game a la Kotal? Only character that jumps to my mind is Grandmaster Sub, who I haven't spent any time with yet. (I don't own the game yet.)

I like War God Kotal. He's not quite Aquaman, but he'll do. For my token whiny buff suggestion, I want NRS to give him Aquaman's trident and his d2. (Kidding. Maybe.)

 

[Michael Bolton]

@Hassun, we shall see my fellow Ogre player =)

@ben, no videos come to mind, but after the Saw Blade special ender, you can go for high/low strings, unique attacks, or specials, as well as a throw. If they don't have meter to armor out, starting a 3 hit string early is useful, in case they delay, such as B1, 2, 2, which you can go the whole way through, letting the overhead rock, or stop early with his Sword Sweep. Also, if they delay, you can of course jump over, letting you do two hit strings such as B1, 4 or F3, 4 with various specials intermixed or used as enders. Hope this helps!

 

[Ben Reed]

i'm still kinda wary about throwing meaty strings on top of people doing delayed wakeup. But that's mostly because I'm still learning various characters' wakeup options. I gravitate towards safe jumps and other wakeup baits because I like to use them to establish a baseline against unknown players; figure out how mashy they are or aren't when I get a good hit in. I'll get more adventurous once I get more lab time in.

Qwark28 posted a 7f safe jump from b32 which I wanna try out, that looks like my jam.

 

[Michael Bolton]

@ben, sure thing. As UltraDavid mentions though, ending in Saw Blade also gives you safe jumps, even against the fastest attacking special in the game (i.e. Reptiles enhanced Slide).

 

[Ben Reed]

I didn't know the knockdown advantage on DF2 was that good. Most of Kotal's other knockdowns had really long recovery, so I assumed that DF2 meant a return to neutral rather than oki. All my lab time so far has just gone into learning his combos. Next time I get to the lab I will definitely work on safe jumps from DF2.

 

[Michael Bolton]

It has to be an empty jump though, but with B3, 2 you can whiff a normal, so props to Qwark28!

 

[SepticFir8]

Did anyone see the vids of Mr Aquaman vs Tom Brady? That was inspiring.

Turns out, Kotal's sword deals much better with the ice clones than one might think.

 

[Hassun]

Did anyone see the vids of Mr Aquaman vs Tom Brady? That was inspiring.

Turns out, Kotal's sword deals much better with the ice clones than one might think.

That's not really new though is it? People with far-reaching moves have a lot fewer problems dealing with ice klones than others.

 

[LeeVanDam]

Did anyone see the vids of Mr Aquaman vs Tom Brady? That was inspiring.

Turns out, Kotal's sword deals much better with the ice clones than one might think.

What's interesting now, is if you forward jump 1 on reaction you can make the clone disappear when Sub Zero blocks the punch. The patch definitely made Kotal's life much easier.

I watched the vids, and they were great. Really sound, took risks at the right times. Well deserved victory for Mr. Aquaman.

 

[Lanqu]

Yep, it does disappear, but my friend just start doing backdash and you get frozen
And cornering yourself against clone without meter still equals loosing =(

 

[LeeVanDam]

Yep, it does disappear, but my friend just start doing backdash and you get frozen
And cornering yourself against clone without meter still equals loosing =(

If Sub Zero backdashes, then you can just Sun Ray yourself. Even if you don't have meter, it'll give you life to be able to mitigate a mix up... if it does come. That also gives you enough time to try a parry when Sub Zero walks back in to stop you from healing.

 

[Lanqu]

Well, backdash is like 20 frames. And SunRay is something like 70+. More over - why he will backdash if not seeing you JIP ?
He will just go to the kitchen, make himself a bottle of warm milk, get some salt for you, go back and land full punish on you spreading salt all over your face.

 

[Crayraven]

Has anyone fought a good quan chi summoner? Its just brutal, kotal kahn is awful vs zoning.

 

[Belial]

Hey guys I just won my second CIS ESL with Kotal, heres footage http://www.twitch.tv/netherrealm/v/5246831

Quater vs Liu Kang at 33:31
Semis vs Takeda at 1:32:15
Finals vs Cassie at 1:46:30

Keep in mind we're playing on PC and its still unpatched (Liu Kang infinite is in etc) b/c High Voltage is that awesome

Also netcode on PC is not that great

 

[Second Saint]

Hey guys I just won my second CIS ESL with Kotal, heres footage http://www.twitch.tv/netherrealm/v/5246831

Quater vs Liu Kang at 33:31
Semis vs Takeda at 1:32:15
Finals vs Cassie at 1:46:30

Keep in mind we're playing on PC and its still unpatched (Liu Kang infinite is in etc) b/c High Voltage is that awesome

Also netcode on PC is not that great

Congratulations, man! I'll watch this as soon as I get a chance.

Glad to see I'm not the only one that recognizes the truly exemplary work High Voltage has done. Best company of 2015 I'd say, if not the single best of all time. They really do work to hard these guys. I mean have you seen the interview with their chairman? Such a jovial, dilligent fellow.

 

[GUN_5LING3R]

Has anyone been using d3 as an anti-air because it works on cross-overs pretty decently
Example: d3 AA f1b2 xx df2 (war god)
It doesnt lower kotal as much as d4 but the hitbox on d3 hits about the height of his head when he crouches and seems to have more reach than his AA grab.

 

[Second Saint]

Has anyone been using d3 as an anti-air because it works on cross-overs pretty decently
Example: d3 AA f1b2 xx df2 (war god)
It doesnt lower kotal as much as d4 but the hitbox on d3 hits about the height of his head when he crouches

Yes, we've known about this for awhile. Here's a post I made about it in the Kahnbo thread. You can get some pretty good damage off of it if you're willing to spend a bar of meter. Decent enough damage meterless as well.

So, after getting blown up by a friend of mine that decided to jump all day, I found kotal's d2...lacking. It just didn't have the right shaped hit box to hit crossup jumps consistently, and I wasn't having any better luck with his air throw. I decided to go to lab and see what I could find and, as it turns out, d3 is a really good AA.

It's 6 frames, it lowers his hit box, it hits surprisingly high, and I can combo off of it.

War God Meterless:
d3, 1, f1b2~df2 (20% hkd)
d3, 1, b122~db1 (21%)
You have to hit them while still pretty high in the air for these next ones to work.
d3, 1, f2, f1b2~df2 (25% hkd)
d3, 1, f2, b122~db1 (27%)

1bar:
d3, b14~EX df1, f1b2~df2 (33% hkd)
d3, b14~EX df1, b122, db1 (35%)
d3, EX df1, f2, f1b2~df2 (34% hkd)
d3, EX df1, f2 b122~db1 (36%)

I tried comboing EX airgrab off the meterless combos with f2, but the gravity gets too high and I can't make the enders connect, though this doesn't mean it's impossible. I listed the 1 bar version with b14 in it because, while slightly less damage, it gives much more time to hit confirm, than going straight to the EX airgrab. As someone who sucks at hit confirming, this seems worth mentioning. (EDIT: I just found out you don't have to cancel the airgrab from d3, so I guess the part about hit confirming is redundant)

Sun God level 3 choke (Meterless):
d3, b14~db2 (23%)
d3, 1, f2, b14~db2 (29%)

1 bar:
d3, b14~ex df1, b14~db2 (37%)
d3, 1, f2, b14~EX df1, b14~db2 (39%)

 

[FrozenSun]

I find it amazing how front-loaded his throw is right now. +37 when everyone else is barely above +10 and he has enough time to check every non-armored wakeup with a meaty d.1 or f.2.

Sorry to sound scrubbish but I don't understand that " +37 after the throw " thing. How can you be at advantage when you throw people to the other side of the planet?
Is it that the recovery is so good you can actually run and be close when they just started getting up? I'm not trying to be funny I really wish to know.

 

[RYX]

Sorry to sound scrubbish but I don't understand that " +37 after the throw " thing. How can you be at advantage when you throw people to the other side of the planet?
Is it that the recovery is so good you can actually run and be close when they just started getting up? I'm not trying to be funny I really wish to know.

placement has nothing to do with advantage

you are + enough that you can run and hit them before they get up

 

[Hassun]

@Belial Putting that paddle to good use! Great performance.
Did you meet any heavy zoners along the way?

 

[Belial]

@Belial Putting that paddle to good use! Great performance.
Did you meet any heavy zoners along the way?

I think Liu Kang and Cassie sort of fall into that category

 

[FrozenSun]

placement has nothing to do with advantage

you are + enough that you can run and hit them before they get up

So you 1+3 them and run? Do you have some pratical exemples maybe even on video? (or tournament footage)
Sorry to insist but I don't totally understand and it sounds sweet so I'd rather look like an idiot for 5 minutes and be a better Kotal forever !
Thx

 

[RYX]

So you 1+3 them and run? Do you have some pratical exemples maybe even on video? (or tournament footage)
Sorry to insist but I don't totally understand and it sounds sweet so I'd rather look like an idiot for 5 minutes and be a better Kotal forever !
Thx

it's not that difficult

just throw, then run immediately and do a d1 at point blank or f2 from its max range