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Question - Tanya How good is Tanya...really?

What is Tanya


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M2Dave

Zoning Master
100% agreed. This would literally break her Dragon Naginata combos.
Which Dragon Naginata combos require the teleport to be 1 frame?

Raiden is of coarse the only char to get absolutely butchered out of those changes lol. You want ex grenade safe and ex rune plus but ex shocker even more punishable? And if you want raidens safe overhead gone get rid of its cancel ability, don't make shocker useless.
What does EX shocker have that EX sand grenade and EX rune do not? Do the thinking.
 

I GOT HANDS

Official Infrared Scorp wid gapless Wi-Fi pressure
I see what you mean. My list is: Kitana, Kenshi, Takeda, Tanya, Jacqui(Shotgun). Now say were mid screen and you jump over my wake up attempt. I can't do shit but eat the combo into wherever you want.

Same shit on subz....... ".... I am Sub-Cero! no FUCKING JUMPING IN MI LA CASA!" Slams fist into palm to show he's serious. +20% combo into standing reset/19% wall carry frame advantage. Yeah I still call it GODLIKE. Quality over Quantity I guess?
Oh good so you play Kenshi too. I don't play the other ones you listed, so I'll go with what I know. I mostly play Kenjutsu. DF1 is an armored wake up with a similarly NICE hitbox (no rear vision like Ice Burst though), that hits Overhead, and converts into 29 or 30% damage, leavings them in a standing reset, except WITH frame advantage, and in range of an F2 overhead or super safe D4 into telepush mix up to capitilise on that frame advantage. And before you mention cross ups, Ice Burst whiffs on proper timed ones as well, and also whiffs on NJP's which Kenshi does not.

I'm sorry, but if Ice Burst is "godlike"... Kenshi's wake up is "race of ascended beings". Not that I think it is, but there is nothing super special about Ice Burst except the hitbox.

It is -10 on block tho, which ain't too bad at all. Just a solid move. Nothing astronomical.
 

SM StarGazer

The voice of reason in a Sea of Salt
Oh good so you play Kenshi too. I don't play the other ones you listed, so I'll go with what I know. I mostly play Kenjutsu. DF1 is an armored wake up with a similarly NICE hitbox (no rear vision like Ice Burst though), that hits Overhead, and converts into 29 or 30% damage, leavings them in a standing reset, except WITH frame advantage, and in range of an F2 overhead or super safe D4 into telepush mix up to capitilise on that frame advantage. And before you mention cross ups, Ice Burst whiffs on proper timed ones as well, and also whiffs on NJP's which Kenshi does not.

I'm sorry, but if Ice Burst is "godlike"... Kenshi's wake up is "race of ascended beings". Not that I think it is, but there is nothing super special about Ice Burst except the hitbox.

It is -10 on block tho, which ain't too bad at all. Just a solid move. Nothing astronomical.
I see your point. Let me ask this. What happens whgn you add the ice clone and its burst damage. You could set it off with ice burst for a second layer of defense tho it's nighimpoosible to setup before had. I also noticed the increase in damage from iceburstclone. I did a simple clone into f3 I believe, the one that starts the gab combo string, then ended with clone.

If I was sub's I stand in front of the clone and snowball then explode it upon any teleport attempt. Now as for Tanya against subsz I love the fact that can punish almost ever ice clone into snowball with a quite run jump teleport. And that's for free. I wouldn't place Kenshi anywhere near godlike though. Even with the changes. To much can bait it then punish. Can ex ice burst beat out the grab or sword slashs?
 
Which Dragon Naginata combos require the teleport to be 1 frame?



What does EX shocker have that EX sand grenade and EX rune do not? Do the thinking.
Ok remove armor of ex shocker and make it -5 - +10 then since that's balanced for launcher specials apparently. And what's your reasoning for wanting regular shocker useless, also further nerfing his other already bad variations ?
 
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I GOT HANDS

Official Infrared Scorp wid gapless Wi-Fi pressure
I see your point. Let me ask this. What happens whgn you add the ice clone and its burst damage. You could set it off with ice burst for a second layer of defense tho it's nighimpoosible to setup before had. I also noticed the increase in damage from iceburstclone. I did a simple clone into f3 I believe, the one that starts the gab combo string, then ended with clone.
Sounds like you are theorycrafting heavily here. For starters, this is heavily positioning dependant, as you have to be standing practically touching the clone for it to shatter, making it an unlikely place for anyone to be jumping in on (seeing as back dash and letting clone freeze them will punish even harder, and for zero meter, in most cases). Obviously, you can't do it off a wake up either, which was the whole point of this discussion. Then, you have to make sure your Ice Burst hits them BEFORE they touch you, making your armour is useless because even tho the animation will armour through, the clone disappears on hit. Then on top of all this, all this doesn't even matter, because what you are suggesting doesn't work, if the Clone shatters on the burst, the shards launch them and you can't combo off it anywhere but directly facing them in the corner. So all you can get off it is 18%, except you don't get the untechable Slide knockdown.

Just a word of advice for the future, you should test these things before making such statements man. Easy to do in practice mode. I don't mind explaining it - others will rage and call you a scrub if you use untested statements like this in discussion


If I was sub's I stand in front of the clone and snowball then explode it upon any teleport attempt. Now as for Tanya against subsz I love the fact that can punish almost ever ice clone into snowball with a quite run jump teleport. And that's for free. I wouldn't place Kenshi anywhere near godlike though. Even with the changes. To much can bait it then punish. Can ex ice burst beat out the grab or sword slashs?
Ice Burst can POSSIBLY beat out Blade-Nado, but there is a real small timing window. Too early and you will connect but he armors through and gets you, time it the same and you armor through each others first hit, except he hits multiple times, so chances are he is going to win this trade everytime. And while you get 18%, he gets 30% and a standing reset with a frame advantage.

I don't think Kenshi is godlike either. But that just further proves that godlike is pretty inaccurate term to describe Iceburst. It's workable. Nothing amazing tho
 
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xWildx

What a day. What a lovely day.
As a Kitana player, I've taken a vow to not comment on how good I feel other characters in this game are (wouldn't want to be hypocritical), but after playing a long set against @RunwayMafia's Pyromancer I'd be lying if I said I didn't think Shroud could use a few adjustments...
 

RunwayMafia

Shoot them. Shoot them all.
As a Kitana player, I've taken a vow to not comment on how good I feel other characters in this game are (wouldn't want to be hypocritical), but after playing a long set against @RunwayMafia's Pyromancer I'd be lying if I said I didn't think Shroud could use a few adjustments...
Exactly. People should be worrying about dark shroud, not her teleport.

The people complaining about her air mobility are stupid and just not that good at the game.

#GoBackToCryingAboutTheClone
 

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
You have only asked for one in this thread.

I would not make the teleport require stamina. Only true rush down fools demands this change. But I would increase the start up of the teleport by several frames. I would also make the following changes.

D'Vorah
- significantly reduce block frame advantage of f+1,1,2 xx WGC

Erron Black
- EX sand grenade is -5 in block

Quan Chi
- EX rune is +10 on block

Raiden
- shocker is -14 on block
- EX shocker is -20 on block

Scorpion
- reduce block from advantage of 2,1,4 xx FBC in Hellfire to prevent uninterruptible loops
No need to nerf scorpions fbc bro. He needs it.
 

Noserfatu

My eyes! The goggles do nothing!
Her myriad of options and quality of tools make her dumb as fuck. Adding insult to injury, all of her variations are good. What other character is good in every variation?

But I'm an illiterate and inarticulate rush down fool, so what do I know?
 
At least her air mixups are punishable. EX forward teleport is too good.

Dark shroud being meterless, safe, and plus 52 on hit is overboard.

She's probably top 5, definitely top 10, and she would continue to be with a couple minor adjustments.

Dark shroud advantage on hit could stand to be toned down to maybe plus 15 on hit, more for EX version, and -8 or 10 on block. Specials that grant enough frame advantage to guarantee a true 50/50 after landing aren't OK when they require no resources and are safe. Remember all the complaining about EX nut punch? Tanya gets that without meter (granted, it knocks down from a juggle).

EX Teleport could stand to have the startup frames increased by a few or have the armor removed / invincibility removed.

This wouldn't change the way she's played for the most part, nor would it render her tools useless. It would just make them consistent with the rest of the game.
 

SaltShaker

In Zoning We Trust
Her myriad of options and quality of tools make her dumb as fuck. Adding insult to injury, all of her variations are good. What other character is good in every variation?
Yet other characters with more options and more tools are fair because they play like Marvel? Maybe we should concentrate on balancing them first before a two week character that will soon be figured out, no?

Off the top of my head characters with 3 tournament viable variations-

Jax. Quan Chi. Johnny Cage. Cassie. Kenshi.

But I'm an illiterate and inarticulate rush down fool, so what do I know?
Apparently.