What's new

Do competitive Fighting game and real fight philosophy differ that much?

Do you think pro gamers would be good on a real life fighting if they did MA?

  • Yes

    Votes: 10 16.7%
  • No

    Votes: 50 83.3%

  • Total voters
    60

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
One of the things that makes fighting games so interesting to me in the first place, is how you can put your brains into work, and learn from your past mistakes, i mean, each characters are given tools to compete, but when the match doesn't narrow down to OP tools it can be a head vs head match game to the point where tier lists doesn't matter.


I came to think about it, and i don't see much of a difference in between a real fight in MA competitive world and fighting games, although i have MA background myself, and now that i've stepped more in to the fighting game world, i came to think that if i knew half of the shit i know now back then, i believe i've would have leveled up much more faster.

First for example, attacks in fighting game often have a pre determined frame data, which implies how fast an attack can be applied although many of them never change outside when buffed or nerved, they have a hit, blockstun recovery frames and hitbox.
In real life, you can acomplish faster attacks by training your body to obey to your commands, and you can train your body to endurace in recieving certain physical attacks, basically you can train your body to have a better control over it on certain things you do.

The other concept that you may notice is quite similar in between how fighting games and real fighting tournaments works is that you can either play neutral game, footsies almost the same way you can do in a fighting game.

You can have a lot of fights to get used to reactions, and get fight experience, so you can expect certain attacks at certain ranges, calm your self and be in better position to counter-attack your opponent's decisions


During my first year graduation, the guy who put me at the Wang You's Kung Fu school, did something i still find impressive today, on a fighting test, he finished his opponents with a 2 hit combo, breaking their center of gravity with a powerful low kick, once they started falling worried about how to land, he uses a body blow right in the belly where is wide open, since they're more worried about a safe landing, the unexpected blow comes with such power that would instantly put them in a situation where the master/refree decided as instant K.O

To remind that same thing happened to Ronda a few days back when she got hit by a High Kick where she didn't even saw where it did came from, to this situation in particular of being hit by unexpected attacks that deals damage you weren't ready to block it can be called counter.



In the end, not only reactions is very important in both aspects of fighting, but having experience and know how fighting either in video games or in real life works, is important.

We have top players in many fighting games, like MK, SF, DOA, Tekken etc etc, do you think that if any top player would seriously practice MU, and apply the philosophy of Fighting games in additional to real life fighting, would he be gud?

Please discuss!
 

Solignac

Noob
Sorry, I just don't see it at all. Taking physical pain, dealing with exhaustion, fighting from a first person perspective, injuring yourself if you practice too extremely, dieting, eyesight, cheap shots. I could go on forever. It's a totally different league. Games are set in stone forever until a patch change but real sports are always dynamic no matter what. Things are always different and factors always change in a way that you can't train for every situation. Sure the philosophy might bear a little resemblance but @Infinite is right. It's like playing pong then saying you'd be good at tennis.
 
One of the things that makes fighting games so interesting to me in the first place, is how you can put your brains into work, and learn from your past mistakes, i mean, each characters are given tools to compete, but when the match doesn't narrow down to OP tools it can be a head vs head match game to the point where tier lists doesn't matter.


I came to think about it, and i don't see much of a difference in between a real fight in MA competitive world and fighting games, although i have MA background myself, and now that i've stepped more in to the fighting game world, i came to think that if i knew half of the shit i know now back then, i believe i've would have leveled up much more faster.

First for example, attacks in fighting game often have a pre determined frame data, which implies how fast an attack can be applied although many of them never change outside when buffed or nerved, they have a hit, blockstun recovery frames and hitbox.
In real life, you can acomplish faster attacks by training your body to obey to your commands, and you can train your body to endurace in recieving certain physical attacks, basically you can train your body to have a better control over it on certain things you do.

The other concept that you may notice is quite similar in between how fighting games and real fighting tournaments works is that you can either play neutral game, footsies almost the same way you can do in a fighting game.

You can have a lot of fights to get used to reactions, and get fight experience, so you can expect certain attacks at certain ranges, calm your self and be in better position to counter-attack your opponent's decisions


During my first year graduation, the guy who put me at the Wang You's Kung Fu school, did something i still find impressive today, on a fighting test, he finished his opponents with a 2 hit combo, breaking their center of gravity with a powerful low kick, once they started falling worried about how to land, he uses a body blow right in the belly where is wide open, since they're more worried about a safe landing, the unexpected blow comes with such power that would instantly put them in a situation where the master/refree decided as instant K.O

To remind that same thing happened to Ronda a few days back when she got hit by a High Kick where she didn't even saw where it did came from, to this situation in particular of being hit by unexpected attacks that deals damage you weren't ready to block it can be called counter.



In the end, not only reactions is very important in both aspects of fighting, but having experience and know how fighting either in video games or in real life works, is important.

We have top players in many fighting games, like MK, SF, DOA, Tekken etc etc, do you think that if any top player would seriously practice MU, and apply the philosophy of Fighting games in additional to real life fighting, would he be gud?

Please discuss!
I like your thought on this subject. I really do belive they both have a lot of similarities.
 

Eddy Wang

Skarlet scientist
Very good point guys, sorry i didn't made myself so clear at the first post btw, this a project because i have plans a possibly craziest comic i've ever written before.

Sorry, I just don't see it at all. Taking physical pain, dealing with exhaustion, fighting from a first person perspective, injuring yourself if you practice too extremely, dieting, eyesight, cheap shots. I could go on forever. It's a totally different league. Games are set in stone forever until a patch change but real sports are always dynamic no matter what. Things are always different and factors always change in a way that you can't train for every situation. Sure the philosophy might bear a little resemblance but @Infinite is right. It's like playing pong then saying you'd be good at tennis.
Sure there is more to it, like the capacity of one to withstand physical attacks, stamina, different speeds and more, but if any top player would seriously practice MA, wouldn't they be able to get fight experience in a way a bit similar to what we get when we train MU?

I know they're are different in a whole, just see a real fighting scene as a game with different mechanics, for example, if someone grabs a bat and is ready to go down swinging, what is the first reaction of common people? Wouldn't a good percentage just cover the part where they think the swing would come at? A experience fighter shouldn't be able to determine in the instant and the position of how the bat was held and consider the possible swinging stances and get ready for the most effective counter the instant that bat is held on?


How is that even a question?
Its a discussion, feel free to share your opinion or your point of view, otherwise you're just dropping by to talk shit, you can show yourself the front door.

Besides, i'm enjoying the answers currently, keep them coming.
 

Darumm

Noob
Although the concepts are there for both things, I believe real fighting is far more complex.

For example, one could say that in real fighting you could poke away from pressure with a jab, but, unlike in the game, there is more to it than just throwing the jab, fighting stance (some may favor lateral movement, punching or kicking, other may favor takedowns, etc), head movement, etc. In real fighting no movement is exactly the same nor it takes a default amount of time, you also can get hit and not be interrupted, the damage of the hit depends of the one who is hitting and the one being hit (for example, is the one being hit moving towards the hit, or is he moving away?), etc.

Also, unlike the majority of fighting games I can think of in which the damage is just cosmetic, the damage in a real fight affects your ability to perform.
 

Wetdoba

All too easy...
I think you guys are missing the point. I wrestled in highschool and did some club judo in college and it is definitely the same kind of mindset. Obviously theres no frame data and shit in real life and you have to be in shape to do it but mentally they are very similiar. Both are 1v1 with a big focus on nuetral and mindgames, feeling out your opponent, and the ability to adapt. Ive moved on to fighting games now after graduating but I wish I played fighting games at the same time I was on the mats rather than after so I could connect the dots between the two, I feel like it would have made me better at both. Id like to hear from other people that actually did wrestle/mma/judo/boxing any other 1v1 contact sport.
 

Kingshootahz

Ain't nobody trilla than shootah.
Real fight- Mental condition,physical condition,technique,stamina,no guarantees.

Fighting games- frame data, links,cosmetic physical deterioration,getting hit in a game and feeling nervous, can never ever be compared to getting hit in a fight and the emotions and thoughts that follow
 

coolwhip

Noob
Spacing and distance might be the only situation where there are some similarities. Everything else is a reach. Like, I can see match-up knowledge being somewhat compared to tape study on your opponent to prepare how to counter certain situations or exploit weaknesses, but still, it's a bit of a stretch.
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
There are lots of similarities, but also a lot of differences.

From a gaming perspective, taking out the physicality, the closer they get to real life - the more immersive and deep a fighting game will be.

...and by realism - I mean applying the strategic layers involved in the real fighting meta to the meta of the fighting game itself...

For instance, zoning tools can be jabs or fireballs. It doesn't matter as long as that aspect is in there. Fighting games have these aspects.

Even 2D fighters fulfill sidestepping within the jumping mechanic. They are different, but it can be argued that it fulfills that aspect of the meta.

What no fighting game has is the aspect of balance, within the pushing and pulling that inevitably goes on within exchanges.

Block advantage does exist in real fighting. There are attacks that are more deadly if blocked than if eaten.

Within my discipline, blocking one of my attacks allows me to begin.
 

carrion4worm

king of the underground
Mkx is a lot like street fighting, which I've had to do a lot of over the years. Keep attacking and don't let them get up!
 

Wetdoba

All too easy...
@Eddy Wang I dont think anyone here really gets what you are going for lol, they are too caught up on the differences between real world vs digital game when they should be focusing on the differences and similarities between "mental state of a fighter during a fight" vs "mental state of a fighting game player in a game."

I think this discussion should be more for people that have actually trained in one of these sports irl, lots of people here sound like they just watch ufc pay per view drunk eating chicken wings with the bros but havent been in the ring themselves at all and know what its like being in that mental state.

Here are the real similiarities:

- Neutral game
- Spacing
- Mind games with opponent
- Reactions
- Punishes (yes there are real life punishes, when your opponent leaves themselves open for a move you have to be ready with said move)
- Conditioning of opponent (mental conditioning)
- Set ups
- Match up knowledge
- Situational awareness
- Tournament nerves

Seriously, if you actually have trained and been in the ring before at all these should not be a surprise to you
 

coolwhip

Noob
@Eddy Wang I dont think anyone here really gets what you are going for lol, they are too caught up on the differences between real world vs digital game when they should be focusing on the differences and similarities between "mental state of a fighter during a fight" vs "mental state of a fighting game player in a game."

I think this discussion should be more for people that have actually trained in one of these sports irl, lots of people here sound like they just watch ufc pay per view drunk eating chicken wings with the bros but havent been in the ring themselves at all and know what its like being in that mental state.

Here are the real similiarities:

- Neutral game
- Spacing
- Mind games with opponent
- Reactions
- Punishes (yes there are real life punishes, when your opponent leaves themselves open for a move you have to be ready with said move)
- Conditioning of opponent (mental conditioning)
- Set ups
- Match up knowledge
- Situational awareness
- Tournament nerves

Seriously, if you actually have trained and been in the ring before at all these should not be a surprise to you
This applies to many forms of one-on-one competition though. Like, I can literally make the same comparisons between tennis and fighting games.
 

UPR_Nova

Noob
True fighting is so much more complex and strenuous, both mentally and physically. Concepts that are labeled as deep in games are hella shallow when you aren't using avatars, at least in MMA. The reason I say this is because I have experience in both and while I understand what you are saying, you have it flipped. It should be "can the top MMA fighters (or boxers, or wrestlers, etc.) do well with video games.

Yes, fighting games have fighting concepts but those concepts are applied to the games, not the game applying them to fighting. I think my time in the cage helped me understand some things about games. For instance, my patience has GREATLY increased and even when I feel I'm being extremely impatient in the game, I'm not. It's because I have a next level approach to patience now. Getting impatient can get you laid out. Spacing is a different story though. I would bait others with my head being in front of my front knee, giving the image they have an open target. They attack there but I know they are going to attack there so I quickly move my head and counter. That doesn't apply to a game because at the simplest point of it all, ONE strike can end that shit really quick.

Another small point, you have to block on a game and most of the time, it's not a bad thing. You get caught blocking for real and you are living on the edge because your opponent is in that ass and their spacing is better. I want you to block. You block your head, I hit your body and vice versa. You block the front of your face, I hit your temples. Block your temples, I got your nose. Block your ribs then body, body, uppercut. High low is the only meta in a fighting game.

I know many will disagree because of his latest performances but Anderson Silva is the greatest example of perfect spacing, timing and speed. He applies knowledge to completely overwhelm the opponent with striking and worked ridiculous angles to get those openings. Wanna see how to space a scrub perfectly, watch him in the legendary days because it's not even fair. Angles is another thing that you can't apply to fighters. Precision, speed and power all stem from the perfect angle.

So in the longest post ever, no, it's the opposite... Combat sports influence fighting games and pro gamers stand no chance in the sport unless they train like everyone else.
 

SneakyTortoise

Official Master of Salt
@Eddy Wang I dont think anyone here really gets what you are going for lol, they are too caught up on the differences between real world vs digital game when they should be focusing on the differences and similarities between "mental state of a fighter during a fight" vs "mental state of a fighting game player in a game."

I think this discussion should be more for people that have actually trained in one of these sports irl, lots of people here sound like they just watch ufc pay per view drunk eating chicken wings with the bros but havent been in the ring themselves at all and know what its like being in that mental state.

Here are the real similiarities:

- Neutral game
- Spacing
- Mind games with opponent
- Reactions
- Punishes (yes there are real life punishes, when your opponent leaves themselves open for a move you have to be ready with said move)
- Conditioning of opponent (mental conditioning)
- Set ups
- Match up knowledge
- Situational awareness
- Tournament nerves

Seriously, if you actually have trained and been in the ring before at all these should not be a surprise to you
I've trained in Wudang kung fu and staff kung fu for years and a bit of Jiu jitsu, so I do have practical knowledge regarding this topic.

Although the things you have listed are similarities in both respects (e.g. having faster reactions will help in both situations), practising martial arts will not help anyone level up in fighting games because the differences are too real. Hell, even practising staff kung fu would not help a Kilik main.

For example, the neutral game and spacing are completely different. Learning footwork and your opponent's reach in martial arts just would not help you recognising it in a 2d game, you would be far better off practising that game.

Any time put into practising martial arts would be far better spent practising the game if your aim was to level up in the game.
 

NY-Shadow

TestYourMight SUCKS
The fact that any pro gamer is a pro gamer tells you that they would not be good at real fighting sports. That is why they play fighting games, because they can not achieve that status in real life. Take for example two good fighting game pro gamers, perfect legend and sonic fox. They are not big, strong looking guys, they're scrawny, skinny weak looking nerds. They would obviously get they're asses whooped by most guys there age. But they are really tough when it comes to pretending to be a character with super powers on a monitor screen.
 

Wetdoba

All too easy...
This applies to many forms of one-on-one competition though. Like, I can literally make the same comparisons between tennis and fighting games.
yeah but the difference between a ball based sport and a contact sport is huge. I'm sure when looking at those bullet points individually they can all apply to tennis but they arent being thought about together simultaneously in the same way because tennis is a tool based sport, as in you have to be good with a standardized tennis racket and tennis ball specifically, which throws it off in my mind. Its about the overall mental state as a whole not the individual aspects
 
Last edited: