Match-up Discussion Tips for Kitana's Bad Matchups

[xKhaoTik]

I've seen a few Bad MU threads for characters and tips on how to overcome the MU. So I figured I'd do one for Kitana, since no one has done it yet.

In the most recent Kitana MU chart, created by Mr. Mileena, kitana has 3 bad MU's:

Kabal 4-6
Freddy 4-6
Kenshi 4-6

There have also been honorable mentions in who are also a bad MU or can be a bad MU (toss ups basically) :

Sonya (4-6 Death)
Sektor
Reptile
Liu Kang
Ermac
Raiden



What do you guys think? Who are Kitana's bad MU(s) and what tips can you provide to help overcome the MU?

 

[BillStickers]

There is one golden rule for all three of these matchups: DON'T JUMP. In Kabal's case, you don't even want to iAF.

I like these threads so I can give my scrubby advice that then gets corrected by the pros, thus helping my game:

Kabal

• Dash cancel-happy Kabals can be checked with ground fans--ground fans beat both dash and EX dash (except on wakeup).
• Don't try to outzone, don't use iAFs (ground fans only).
• Always d1 out of pressure. Kabal's fastest normal is 7 frames vs. Kitana's 6 frame d1. Her d3 is 7 frames, which means he can potentially out-poke you.
• I get blown up with EX dash by trying to d1 under iAGBs, so i usually just duck and block and take the chip.
• Pretty much want to stick with 21~cutter and b12 here. Other strings are too risky.

Freddy

• instant EX ass is your friend. It beats out Sweet Dreams and Dream Shift. Instant ass also beats a naked Nightmare Stance (i.e. if it isn't immediately followed by a NS attack).

Kenshi

• I follow Mr. Mileena's advice here:
  • Throw fans to make him respect them (remember that 2 rapid iafs will cancel out the first reflected iaf)
  • Dash block in (pay attention to his meter so you know when you should be blocking a low teleflurry)
  • Bait out a Rising Karma and punish with 21.
  • Capitalize on whiffed telekenesis moves by crossing up.
  • Don't get impatient and try to jump in too soon.

Ermac
Honestly, this shouldn't be that hard of a matchup. He has ONE frame trap (F1,1,4) that's only +4 on block, so in reality he shouldn't be pressuring you at all. The only thing that makes this matchup a tossup is that he has a very high damage potential and that you have to take a lot of chip to get in if you're knocked full screen.

Sektor
The trick here is to respect Sektor's options. His low starter, his safe teleport, and his flamethrower zoning are all godly. Do not try to beat them! Don't throw fans in this match, either--you WILL eat an instant air teleport.

Interested to hear what people have to say about Sonya.

 

[xKhaoTik]

There is one golden rule for all three of these matchups: DON'T JUMP. In Kabal's case, you don't even want to iAF.

I like these threads so I can give my scrubby advice that then gets corrected by the pros, thus helping my game:

Kabal

• Dash cancel-happy Kabals can be checked with ground fans--ground fans beat both dash and EX dash (except on wakeup).
• Don't try to outzone, don't use iAFs (ground fans only).
• Always d1 out of pressure. Kabal's fastest normal is 7 frames vs. Kitana's 6 frame d1. Her d3 is 7 frames, which means he can potentially out-poke you.
• I get blown up with EX dash by trying to d1 under iAGBs, so i usually just duck and block and take the chip.
• Pretty much want to stick with 21~cutter and b12 here. Other strings are too risky.

Freddy

• instant EX ass is your friend. It beats out Sweet Dreams and Dream Shift. Instant ass also beats a naked Nightmare Stance (i.e. if it isn't immediately followed by a NS attack).

Kenshi

• I follow Mr. Mileena's advice here:
  • Throw fans to make him respect them (remember that 2 rapid iafs will cancel out the first reflected iaf)
  • Dash block in (pay attention to his meter so you know when you should be blocking a low teleflurry)
  • Bait out a Rising Karma and punish with 21.
  • Capitalize on whiffed telekenesis moves by crossing up.
  • Don't get impatient and try to jump in too soon.

Ermac
Honestly, this shouldn't be that hard of a matchup. He has ONE frame trap (F1,1,4) that's only +4 on block, so in reality he shouldn't be pressuring you at all. The only thing that makes this matchup a tossup is that he has a very high damage potential and that you have to take a lot of chip to get in if you're knocked full screen.
Sektor
The trick here is to respect Sektor's options. His low starter, his safe teleport, and his flamethrower zoning are all godly. Do not try to beat them! Don't throw fans in this match, either--you WILL eat an instant air teleport.
Interested to hear what people have to say about Sonya.

Awesome answer lol.

 

[STB Sgt Reed]

D1 a bitch.

 

[xKhaoTik]

D1 a bitch.

-15 on block and -1 on hit

 

[BillStickers]

Awesome answer lol.

lol i try all this stuff and I still get blown up by these guys ._______.'

 

[xKhaoTik]

lol i try all this stuff and I still get blown up by these guys ._______.'

Lol...only kenshi is the one Bad mu that gives me the most trouble. Blind bastard...

 

[RTM2004]

How do you approach a Liu Kang that instant air Fireball your jump in attempts and instant air Fan trades and low Fireball you trying to close in space.. soon as you get in he can punish her whiffed D1 and 2,1 and he can even AA her jump kick~Fan attempts? Not only that, he has armor which Kitana does not have, I'm jealous. Ex Ass in doesn't always work to get in but it's worth a try, at least for me it is XD

 

[RTM2004]

Interested to hear what people have to say about Sonya.

Sonya is very hard to fight up close, her D4, standing 1, Dive Kick and Ex Cartwheel make it difficult. I would do instant air fans from full screen only, don't do jump in fan tossing because Sonya has her D4, standing 1 and MSB2 to catch Kitana in the air throwing a fan before she lands and I have to respect Sonya can do her armored Ex Arc Kick to knock Kitana out of the air. Trying to zone Sonya can be a challenge but if Kitana gets the zoning lead early, she can delay Sonya's Pink Rings from coming out to trade for knockdowns. Deep jump kick~Fan attempts work to punish Sonya trying to D4/poke her way in throwing her Pink Rings, I find cross over jump kick~Fan combos useful too. The good thing is that if Sonya makes the wrong read and you happen to block her Dive Kick or Arc Kick, you can punish Sonya very heavy with 2,1,Ex Fan 45%+ combo. Kitana shouldn't be poke happy either with her D1 and D3 with the threat of Dive Kick and Ex Cartwheel combo launchers. I would just play Kitana real safe against Sonya but her zoning is not enough for her to win the match alone, a low ground projectile would've helped Kitana XD

 

[Natalka]

About the sektor matchup I can say that u can throw iAF from time to time to make him scout for them. This could open a lil' bit of Kit's game

 

[BillStickers]

About the sektor matchup I can say that u can throw iAF from time to time to make him scout for them. This could open a lil' bit of Kit's game

I don't agree with this. Zoning Sektor is a lose-lose situation. A Sektor that's waiting for an iAF can punish with iaTP on reaction for 30%. A Sektor that's purely zoning will eventually start to win the trades--he just has too many projectile options. Every iAF you throw is actually keeping you further from him--you MUST get up close in order to win this match.

 

[Natalka]

Yes, I agree but my point is you should play rushdown but throw iAF from time to time

 

[Mr. Mileena]

Yes, I agree but my point is you should play rushdown but throw iAF from time to time

Vs sektor is scary to throw even just one, because a sektor with good reactions can punish an IAF on reaction by teleporting

 

[Jimmypotato]

The biggest problem I have with Sonya is not being able to AA, you have to respect the dive kick, so when she gets a chance to jump it's hard to decide weather or not to go for it.

Getting free jump ins on kitana means death. you can't wiff anything either, wiff 2,1 get dive kicked, wiff F21 (not that I try to, but it happens) get dive kicked. Her standing jab is a real bitch too, sonya players can just mash that shit when there caught in stuff or if they need to AA in a pinch, you'd be surprised at what it interupts. Ive been standing 1's AA'd by Sonyas while going for deep cross over JK combos as well. The bitch is a real bitch. I agree with this being 6-4 for Sonya after about 70 offline matches at NWM against a great Sonya player. MS after shit helps her so much in the counter poking game as well. Kitana doesn't have alot of options after a counter poke.

remember 6-4 isn't unwinnable, it just means she has the advantage, which I believe she does.

 

[YOMI Trepound380]

How do you approach a Liu Kang that instant air Fireball your jump in attempts and instant air Fan trades and low Fireball you trying to close in space.. soon as you get in he can punish her whiffed D1 and 2,1 and he can even AA her jump kick~Fan attempts? Not only that, he has armor which Kitana does not have, I'm jealous. Ex Ass in doesn't always work to get in but it's worth a try, at least for me it is XD

what works for me is dash blocking into jump range and when they throw a regular or a low fb, jk fan combo. against liu kit shouldnt try to trade or zone him out cause of the low fb. but all in all liu is one of the few chars kit cannot and should not try to zone or trade with

 

[ragnar0kz28]

Im starting to think Sektor is a bad match for Kitana aswell I just dont know I like to zone, cant do it in this match, I like to jump, cant do it either because the flamethrower will get me, can only poke and hope he jumps so I can get him on reaction, I want some tips in this match plz.

 

[Verstande]

i hate reptile

 

[Death]

I'm not 100% positive on the 6-4 Sonya favor. Its just my opinion. Yes i have a lot of good experiences fighting Kitanas with Sonya online but I really dont want to make the MU official unless i play the best Kitanas offline in long sets. In theory Sonya should not lose this MU. Sonya players should address Kitana like they do with Mileena. But Kitana is harder to keep cornered because Sonya cant use her dangerous corner game vs Kitana like she can vs Mileena. If Sonya loses this MU then its because shes dropping her big damaging combos or jumping around. Jump kick fan should never hit sonya on cross ups anyways. She should be doing ex Carthweel or uppercut if she has no meter on reaction.

 

[Salad Petresky]

I think kitana f21 has a farther reach then kenshi spirit charge right? So in a way, the best way to approach this mu probably bait out charge and wiff punish with f21

 

[Death]

Im starting to think Sektor is a bad match for Kitana aswell I just dont know I like to zone, cant do it in this match, I like to jump, cant do it either because the flamethrower will get me, can only poke and hope he jumps so I can get him on reaction, I want some tips in this match plz.

How do you expect to win a MU by chucking fans and jumping? Sektor is bad because your not playing Kitana properly. I wouldnt really blame Sektor, you should look at how you address this MU. Obviously those tactics arent going to work vs good Sektor players. It doesn't mean the MU is bad.

 

[Death]

I think kitana f21 has a farther reach then kenshi spirit charge right? So in a way, the best way to approach this mu probably bait out charge and wiff punish with f21

Cant Kitana just EX fan toss a whiffed shoulder for big damage. Thats a really good move vs Kenshi. Not a lot of characters can get big damage combos off ex projectiles.

 

[Mr. Mileena]

I'm not 100% positive on the 6-4 Sonya favor. Its just my opinion. Yes i have a lot of good experiences fighting Kitanas with Sonya online but I really dont want to make the MU official unless i play the best Kitanas offline in long sets. In theory Sonya should not lose this MU. Sonya players should address Kitana like they do with Mileena. But Kitana is harder to keep cornered because Sonya cant use her dangerous corner game vs Kitana like she can vs Mileena. If Sonya loses this MU then its because shes dropping her big damaging combos or jumping around. Jump kick fan should never hit sonya on cross ups anyways. She should be doing ex Carthweel or uppercut if she has no meter on reaction.

Match ups are not made due to the skill of the player.
It is based on the tools the character has, and how far and how efficient they can use them vs the particular opponent.

Sonya will never lose this matchup.
Imo, sonya does not have the advantage either, as I already explained in another post.

 

[Mr. Mileena]

Im starting to think Sektor is a bad match for Kitana aswell I just dont know I like to zone, cant do it in this match, I like to jump, cant do it either because the flamethrower will get me, can only poke and hope he jumps so I can get him on reaction, I want some tips in this match plz.

You need to stop relying on iaf's to win, if that's how you play, I'm just going to duck 100% of the match.

Iafs are good, but you can't expect to win with them.
also, stop jumping, if you jump, always do a jump kick as they are harder to AA.

 

[Death]

Mr. Mileena

Yeah exactly. MUs are based off each character played perfectly. If Sonya loses than its because shes not being played perfectly and the other player is just outplaying the person. Thats what I meant. Player error doesn't mean anything when it comes to matchups and tier lists. I'm not saying Sonya beats Kitana its just my opinion.

 

[Salad Petresky]

Cant Kitana just EX fan toss a whiffed shoulder for big damage. Thats a really good move vs Kenshi. Not a lot of characters can get big damage combos off ex projectiles.

But the ex fan has 22 frame start up, f21 has 12. They both deal about the same about of damage too but you lose 1 meter with ex fan. Im not just sure this f21 can punish kenshi shoulder.