What.So still no reason to use Cryomancer over Grandmaster? Such a bummer because, aesthetically, it's such a fucking cool variation. I wish they did more with the ice weapons. A Kenshi like projectile slash with the Kori Blade would have been nice.
He's got a pretty damn easy 39% combo that can be pulled off online and only costs a bar. That, plus being able to cancel into overhead and low specials mid combo give it a life of its own. It may not be as good as Grandmaster for people who take this game super seriously, but it definitely has some great tools and damage.So still no reason to use Cryomancer over Grandmaster? Such a bummer because, aesthetically, it's such a fucking cool variation. I wish they did more with the ice weapons. A Kenshi like projectile slash with the Kori Blade would have been nice.
Yeah, I know it's a fine variation. I just don't like 1 variation overtly exceeding the other 2. Maybe it's naive for me to expect that level of balance, but I was hoping variation choice would come down to personal taste instead of which one outclasses the others. I guess having that godly d2 and f4, 2, 1+3 is pretty worth it but I can't ignore the utility of the ice clone.What.
Cryomancer is a perfectly good stand-alone variation. All of Subzero's variations are useful in some way when other chars have barely 2 worth writing home about.
fool proof AA. On all jumpsAnyone can give some input about when it's better to use the bomb/MB Bomb over the overhead hammer/MB hammer? Right now I'm in a good place with this variation but I haven't figured out how to use this move to my advantage.
The fact that is blockable on any position keeps me using the hammer and slide (even if slide is really punishable) over it when I'm waking up, and I usually antiair with the enhanced sword upercut. I still want to use the full arsenal to optimize the character as much as I can, so any advise about what place the bomb takes on Cryomancer's arsenal is welcome.
I don't know who told you this or who said this. EX Hammer alone should be a valid reason to use Cryomancer.So still no reason to use Cryomancer over Grandmaster? Such a bummer because, aesthetically, it's such a fucking cool variation. I wish they did more with the ice weapons. A Kenshi like projectile slash with the Kori Blade would have been nice.
love this combo but its such a bitch online (or i am probably to slow )B2, Run F421+3 (31%)
No one in particular. It's just based on the overall general sentiment on the boards. I'll mess around in the lab with ex hammer later. I didn't know it was that great so thanks for the heads up.I don't know who told you this or who said this. EX Hammer alone should be a valid reason to use Cryomancer.
Yeah, the damage potential off of EX. Hammer is pretty awesome. If anything Cryo-Sub just feels right. He already produces solid damage numbers without meter and with it he only gets better. It just feels like a solid trade exchanging one bar for a possible 39% percent damage mid-screen.No one in particular. It's just based on the overall general sentiment on the boards. I'll mess around in the lab with ex hammer later. I didn't know it was that great so thanks for the heads up.
Okay, correction. Had to go back and re-read page 1 of this thread. According to Tom's notes the A. Hammer can only be punished by the game's fastest attacks.Yeah, the damage potential off of EX. Hammer is pretty awesome. If anything Cryo-Sub just feels right. He already produces solid damage numbers without meter and with it he only gets better. It just feels like a solid trade exchanging one bar for a possible 39% percent damage mid-screen.
On occasion I've thrown out an Air Hammer attack online only because I knew that my opponent wasn't expecting it. Problem is that it's negative on block and I'm sire it only worked because my opponent being unfamiliar with the matchup and all.
B2 B2 F4 2 1+3 is 37% for no meter and stupid easy to doMy findings, summed up by both personal experience and what I've read in this thread.
B33 and F33 will *not* chain into Ice Ball midscreen. Only works in a corner.
Best corner combos:
-B12, EX Hammer, NJP, B2, F421+3 (meter)
-B12, Ice Ball, JIP, B2, F421+3 (meterless)
Slide recovers superfast now and is hard to punish.
F42 is hard to punish even if someone jumps over it. It gives Sub-Zero enough distance to avoid punishments. Adding 1+3 to the end of that will likely get you completely punished.
Best ways to follow-up F421+3:
-B2
-D4
-B3
-Low Block
-Standing Block
-B12
-D2 (Uppercut)
-Maybe even Slide since it's not as easy to punish.
Summing up notes mainly for personal reference, but hopefully this will help other players as well.
Ex bomb run F4 2 1+3 27% punish for a jump in or a nice armor for a negative block string like scorpions b3 2 f2 hit it before the f2 and he wont do that again..Anyone can give some input about when it's better to use the bomb/MB Bomb over the overhead hammer/MB hammer? Right now I'm in a good place with this variation but I haven't figured out how to use this move to my advantage.
The fact that is blockable on any position keeps me using the hammer and slide (even if slide is really punishable) over it when I'm waking up, and I usually antiair with the enhanced sword upercut. I still want to use the full arsenal to optimize the character as much as I can, so any advise about what place the bomb takes on Cryomancer's arsenal is welcome.
Combos off of:No one in particular. It's just based on the overall general sentiment on the boards. I'll mess around in the lab with ex hammer later. I didn't know it was that great so thanks for the heads up.
If you are trying Mr. Brady's combos, some of those are more strict on execution than they are worth IMO. Really, for 1 or 2% less damage you can do far more consistent/easy combos. I've revised some myself.I keep dropping damn combos, man. The worst parts are when I do Cold Blooded and they hop right under my arms at the grab portion of the attack.
I'll have to try those. Thanks.If you are trying Mr. Brady's combos, some of those are more strict on execution than they are worth IMO. Really, for 1 or 2% less damage you can do far more consistent/easy combos. I've revised some myself.
@Qwark28 IIRC posted some tech with it that allowed to restand the opponent with I believe he said +16 frames. I've been trying to duplicate it but it's tricky (for what I've seen, you have to manage to get the hammer hitting just once instead of twice as the second hit is the one that knocks them down). I'm not sure if that frame advantage means you can "keep the same combo" going without block opportunity or if it's just like Quan Chi's portal stab where you can't attack but you can block). Maybe Qwark could throw some more light there, I've been able to replicate it from antiair EX Bomb, NJP, JIP, Air Hammer but I'm not sure how do you need to time it and most times I don't restand the opponent.Air Hammer is so damn useless. Someone educate me as to why it should be a thing.
Projectile trades dude. No one wants to trade with Sub. Hit confirming into ice ball is usually counter productive but ice ball should definitely be used in all variations. Enhanced ice ball is even better due to it absorbing projectiles and b2, run, f4, 2, enhanced ice ball, njp, jp, f4, 2, 1+3 carries the opponent to the corner from over midscreen.imo cryomancer dont need iceball to do combos, lowers his damage too much and is really unsafe on block so you have better options. you can get as much or more damage with a simpler JIP>B+2>run up>F+4,2,grab