What's new

Off-Topic Discussion for the day: Should jobs that provide full Health benefits have requirements?

MKF30

Fujin and Ermac for MK 11
I don't think so, personally I feel it's non of their business depending what the coverage is for if they have to go for certain tests(some depending can be rather personal or embarrassing for some people). If it's for basic check ups or just requires just a phone call from the doctor I guess it's ok. Only requirement IMO should be you go to work, do your job. To me that was always the fair tradeoff, I mean workers for your company do their job, a good job preferably and in return you pay them and give them benefits for them helping your company.

The tax gig is tricky, especially when that's something that's almost always changing.

P.S. I'd never move to Canada for health coverage of all things lol, I'd be dead by the time I need a procedure done. No thanks lol and I do go every other year for check ups. Which already takes weeks sometimes months in advance to make depending. lol
 

Crathen

Death is my business
I'm saying people can control their own behavior and make healthy choices, and can also choose to work hard to get a job that offers health care benefits (and pay premiums deductibles whatever). But a lot of people just want a handout via entitlement programs.
And why that can't be done with a nationalized health care?You could lower the taxes on people who take tests once a year and prove to be healthy.

Yes, I know how yours works. People that actually work help pay the bill for those that aren't working; healthy people that work help pay for people that don't work. It creates incentives to NOT be healthy or NOT to work, or both. Multiple studies have shown that if people feel "safe" doing something, they'll be more reckless doing that thing as they believe they are safe. Your system makes people feel safe not working not being healthy, so that's what they end up doing. Its not sustainable though, as soon the unhealthy will outnumber the healthy, and your health care costs will skyrocket. Also due to the control on what doctors / researchers can make, there is less incentive for them to do so.
Your studies do not match reality as in fact my country is healtier than US by far and has a nationalized healthcare system.Both healthy and non-healthy people work and pay the same amount and both are covered , if someone happens to not work at the time ( and seriously how can you afford a living without a job / money , you'll be forced to if you don't wanna starve to death ) they don't have to worry not getting good quality healthcare ( and yes bad healthcare can still happen both in our and your systems , another thing bound to happen ) . The road to have people care more about being healthy isn't only about working out or eating healthy , you need a mindset of well-being and physical benefits to actually get people to start giving a damn about being healthy.

[/quote]

The US healthcare system does need reform, but forcing healthy hardworking people to pay for everyone else isn't the answer. The fact is that people all over the whole come here because we do have the best treatment options, which are a result the framework of our country.
And at the same time some people in your country doesn't get healthcare for a different reason than not being healthy. I don't get what's so hard to grasp about protecting working and lower classes wich is the larger % of the population. [/quote]

Your caloric needs seem way off; the only people I know of that need 4000 calories a day are bodybuilders, the really big guys. 2000 is what the government says are normal caloric needs per day. And if you really do need that much energy, pasta is super cheap and LOADED with calories. One box has 1,200 calories for a pound, and costs only a couple of dollars. Of course you'd want protein too, and you can get a pound of ground turkey (93% lean) for $3.99. That's another 600 calories right there bringing the total to 1,800 (and remember, you're only shooting for 2000). So that's maybe $6, and you can get a can of spaghetti sauce for $0.99. So there's no reason you need calories form McDonalds (and that's unhealthy due to the high fat / saturated fat and salt content). Notice that even bodybuilders that need the amount of calories you suggest don't get it by McDonalds.
It's not my caloric need , mine is around 2000 for weight loss ( actually weighting 85 kg , height 1,80 , im losing 1 kg per week now after losing 8 kg in the first month ). If i didn't know how to prepare and cook my meals ( and i have time to cook my meals as i work 15 minutes from home , i have an hour break at launch to cook and eat ) you'd be damn sure i wouldn't be eating this healthy. It's way easier , faster and more accessible to get to those calories w snacks , sodas , cookies , pizza and so on.Did i also say that junk food is more tasty?Yet another reason to eat unhealthy.

You can also cook unhealthy foods for cheap if you know how to prepare them.

My sister has a very healthy diet and she is Vegan, so that's no eggs, dairy, meat, or fish, or anything that's not plant based. And you also need to realize that food is very cheap here in the US, so yes it is very easy to eat healthy and cheaply here. There are a bunch of nutritionists here that say that's actually out biggest issue, is that our food is so cheap so we buy and eat more. You can even eat McDonalds once in a while if you do it in moderation and sane portion sizes, and don't sit on your ass all day.
Never said you can't be healthy without eating all those foods , but a balanced diet needs those in different variations.You can't expect everyone to have the time and will to research and buy all the vegetables / legumes and so on and give up meat / fish / dairy products.

Food is a basic need so it's natural to stock up on it and quite a lot of people feel tempted eating a little more than they need , even if it costed more you'd see more people scrapping other unnecessary things before they cut on food costs.
 

Deftonesrc

Electrical Engineering bitch!
Wow , sorry sir but you need to experience living in another part of the world.

What you are saying is messed up on so many levels.
Lol, sorry, already married. my wife works at the local hospital actually, which is how I get some of my info.
haha, I'm married myself. My wife is an elementary school teacher, and I am an electrical engineer. I'm just sitting back enjoying you destroy these silly emotion-laced arguments with sound reasoning and fact.

You do realize, however, that you are a god among insects though right? I would wager that 85% of the people here have no concept of being independent or responsible, yet seem to have all the answers to life's problems. . .

Ohwell, its entertaining nonetheless. As for myself, I am one of those idiots who did that illogical thing of "pulling themselves up by the bootstraps" and actually worked hard for the things I have in life. I genuinely hate when people try and make a moral argument in saying that I owe them health care (because you know. . . taxes). In reality I dont mind helping people who are willing to help themselves but, if left to their own devices, people who are offered handouts are statistically unlikely to work hard and reject said handout. Such is human nature. Pretending this isnt the case is just silly.
 

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
Ohwell, its entertaining nonetheless. As for myself, I am one of those idiots who did that illogical thing of "pulling themselves up by the bootstraps" and actually worked hard for the things I have in life. I genuinely hate when people try and make a moral argument in saying that I owe them health care (because you know. . . taxes). In reality I dont mind helping people who are willing to help themselves but, if left to their own devices, people who are offered handouts are statistically unlikely to work hard and reject said handout. Such is human nature. Pretending this isnt the case is just silly.
This is a common misconception that really needs to be put to rest.
http://www.utexas.edu/depts/ic2/et/learner/general.html
http://www.anitra.net/homelessness/columns/anitra/eightmyths.html


The reason people who are on welfare stay on welfare is because they cannot afford to get an education to acquire marketable skills. You can be the hardest working person in the world, but if you dont have access to resources that provide you with certain skills you will always be working minimum wage jobs, and in this economy you cannot live on a minimum wage without some sort of welfare.

Edit: I took out the statistics because they didnt give the full picture and could be taken out of context. I highly recommend reading those articles, especially if you actually believe most welfare recipients are unemployed.
 

Crathen

Death is my business
You do realize, however, that you are a god among insects though right? I would wager that 85% of the people here have no concept of being independent or responsible, yet seem to have all the answers to life's problems. . .

Ohwell, its entertaining nonetheless. As for myself, I am one of those idiots who did that illogical thing of "pulling themselves up by the bootstraps" and actually worked hard for the things I have in life. I genuinely hate when people try and make a moral argument in saying that I owe them health care (because you know. . . taxes). In reality I dont mind helping people who are willing to help themselves but, if left to their own devices, people who are offered handouts are statistically unlikely to work hard and reject said handout. Such is human nature. Pretending this isnt the case is just silly.
Wtf? You don't know anything about me or what things happened in my life ( not getting defensive , just stating facts ) , for what you know i could be a spoiled kid playing videogames all day or someone busting his ass off every day of the week saturdays / sundays included w 3 hours of free time a day , i give my opinion on a subject i thought was important since we're talking about basic human rights. I do not pretend nor speak as someone who knows everything , i am a reasonable guy.

It's not a handout , because everyone is paying for it w taxes.

Try putting yourself in another one pants where -no matter how much you tried or wanted to- your ambient didn't allow you to live with the prospect of advancing in the next social class , now this guy actually works , maybe even more than you but the pay and his surrounding area simply don't allow him to buy and own important things ( a house , maybe a car or all the tools to optimize your work ) and can barely afford feed and get an education for his family while paying the same taxes you do , but his job doesn't give him health insurance ( or having to work off the books ).

This isn't a unrealistic or moral situation , it's some people reality , no need to feel all teary for the guy but wouldn't it be better for him to feel safe while doing his job?You aren't paying the taxes only for him but for you and everyone else who will be in need. Do you think a person in a similar situation would stop working or try to make his life better just because now he doesn't have to worry getting injured and while not getting money?Would you stop working as hard for because now you'd have access to good healthcare?You'd be a fool saying yes.

Either way , i'm out of this thread , getting too OT.
 
Last edited:

Zoidberg747

My blades will find your heart
American College of Sports Medicine activity recommendations:

200 min of moderate intensity activity per week for weight maintenance
250 min of moderate intensity activity per week for weight loss

It can be difficult to do this every week. I'll bet 90% of this site doesn't meet these standards and is considered "inactive" by definition.
Does this include rests between sets/laps, or is it continuous 200 mins?
 

Fractured_Shadow

Really likes to throw things at you.
Im just gonna throw this out there....
This is not a troll question and I'm very serious about it and I wanna hear from all sides

Our country has enormous health issues, millions from the poorest to the wealthiest develop diabetes (develop not born with) and develop a numerous amount of health problems. I'll stop here w that and just ask the question

Should full time jobs that provide health insurance/benefits/Dental require the employee to provide evidence of an annual physical as well as evidence of attendance with a gym 3x minimum a week - one hour / or "XYZ" amounts per month barring any pre existing injury, handicapped properties in order to keep their companies health insurance and benefits provided for the employee ?

Think about the following:
Overall country health
Epidemic of diabetes developed (not born with)
Reduced cost for tax payers to pay for these issues
Etc

Just some thought today for a maybe interesting discussion
I feel incentive programs work far better than punishment. You cannot deny health care based upon fitness level but you sure can reward those who take care of themselves.

Take my job for example. Not only am I tested twice a month for narcotics (SWAT officers have much stricter rules due to the nature of the situations we are put into), but my health care is set up in a way that the base coverage that is offered to everyone is insanly expensive if you are: overweight, smoker, fail PT test, and have been found to have high BP/Colesterol.

Now what my agency does is give "incentives" for fitness. Because I passed my PT test, am 8% body fat, am not a smoker, and all my blood work is good my incentive is FREE health coverage for me and my family... so in other words I save $600 a month over joe fatass who has the exact same coverage but has pay for it....
 
Last edited:

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Im just gonna throw this out there....


I feel insentive programs work far better than punishment. You cannot deny health care based upon fitness level but you sure can reward those who take care of themselves.

Take my job for example. Not only am I tested twice a month for narcotics (SWAT officers have much stricter rules due to the nature of the situations we are put into), but my health care is set up in a way that the base coverage that is offered to everyone is insanly expensive if you are: overweight, smoker, fail PT test, and have been found to have high BP/Colesterol.

Now what my agency does is give "incentives" for fitness. Because I passed my PT test, am 8% body fat, am not a smoker, and all my blood work is good my incentive is FREE health coverage for me and my family... so in other words I save $600 a month over joe fatass who has the exact same coverage but has pay for it....
Reading this post (which I love)
The privilege levels shown in this thread are fucking disgusting jesus christ
Vs this one was disgusting
 

TH3DISTURBED1

"Never say 'never'
You don't know what it's like to live in poverty as a single mother of 3. Taking care of sick family members. Or whatever other obstacles are in the way. Some people slave at work, get their kids ready for school, and pass out just to get 4 hours of sleep.
This WILL come off cold hearted: if you cannot afford to have children, don't. I can't afford children so I don't have them. When I can afford children, I will not be having 3 if I can afford 2. That goes back to personal responsibilities. I don't believe anyone should die over something like this, but how is it fair for somebody who plans to take care of the irresponsible?
 

Under_The_Mayo

Master of Quanculations
This WILL come off cold hearted: if you cannot afford to have children, don't. I can't afford children so I don't have them. When I can afford children, I will not be having 3 if I can afford 2. That goes back to personal responsibilities. I don't believe anyone should die over something like this, but how is it fair for somebody who plans to take care of the irresponsible?
I agree. I won't be having children because I'm irresponsible and I wouldn't be able to take care of them. But this is, and always will be, an imperfect system. And I don't believe in punishing people for having children, and especially in ways that will ultimate punish the children too who had no say in their own existence.