Afro_physicist
Hat Trick
What is the community consensus on her match-ups?
I watched some of your play against Honeybee.It is too early to discuss match ups, but teleport characters may currently be classified as the most difficult adversaries. I can provide a general gameplay description of Pyromancer, so Tanya players can deduce what works and what does not against each character.
Tanya is a zoning and run away character whose gameplay revolves around the teleport, which is one of the best mobility tools in the game. An instant aerial back teleport is more or less a pre-patch Black Adam backdash that costs no stamina meter. The basic strategy involves running away with back teleports and punishing runs and dashes with grounded fireballs and instant aerial fireballs. The fireballs are non-traditional. Tanya tosses each high and low grounded fireball and each instant aerial high and low fireball at various angles. You have to familiarize yourself with the angles and the space they occupy to avoid getting punished. The EX fireball starts at 9 frames, travels horizontally, and absorbs most other fireballs.
At mid range, you have access to f+2, which is a long-ranged back fist that hits twice. The first hit starts up at 13 frames while the second hits at a much later frame (most likely 20+). f+2 can be safely canceled into the dark shroud, which is -4 on block and around +50 on hit. If the dark shroud connects, a fully charged f+3 cannot be interrupted, which may create a 50/50 mix up with a perfectly run-canceled f+3 into b+3. My execution is not good enough to perform this feat yet, at least not consistently. In addition to being safe and +50 on hit, the EX dark shroud has one hit of armor and is safe on block too. It also buffs the damage and chip damage of all fireballs, including the last hit of b+3,1,2. Speaking of b+3,1,2, the last hit is +2 block, but every character can armor through the last hit. Some characters with fast armor moves can even armor through the second hit.
Finally, Tanya has an amazing set of wake up attacks. She has access to four armored attacks in Pycromancer - the flip kick, a highly punishable overhead attack that results in an untechable knockdown, the Cammy-esque drill, a highly punishable low attack that launches, the aforementioned EX dark shroud that is safe on block and +50 on hit, and the EX teleport, which hits high but has one hit of armor and can be canceled into another teleport to escape the corner.
I played with that strategy (pyro) against pressure characters like Dvorrah, Johnny, Cassie, Sonya, and LIu Kang and that worked out well. But, like you said, teleport type characters are more of a problem. DN might be a better variation for those matchups because of its ability to capitalize on damage from f2 or 112.It is too early to discuss match ups, but teleport characters may currently be classified as the most difficult adversaries. I can provide a general gameplay description of Pyromancer, so Tanya players can deduce what works and what does not against each character.
Tanya is a zoning and run away character whose gameplay revolves around the teleport, which is one of the best mobility tools in the game. An instant aerial back teleport is more or less a pre-patch Black Adam backdash that costs no stamina meter. The basic strategy involves running away with back teleports and punishing runs and dashes with grounded fireballs and instant aerial fireballs. The fireballs are non-traditional. Tanya tosses each high and low grounded fireball and each instant aerial high and low fireball at various angles. You have to familiarize yourself with the angles and the space they occupy to avoid getting punished. The EX fireball starts at 9 frames, travels horizontally, and absorbs most other fireballs.
At mid range, you have access to f+2, which is a long-ranged back fist that hits twice. The first hit starts up at 13 frames while the second hits at a much later frame (most likely 20+). f+2 can be safely canceled into the dark shroud, which is -4 on block and around +50 on hit. If the dark shroud connects, a fully charged f+3 cannot be interrupted, which may create a 50/50 mix up with a perfectly run-canceled f+3 into b+3. My execution is not good enough to perform this feat yet, at least not consistently. In addition to being safe and +50 on hit, the EX dark shroud has one hit of armor and is safe on block too. It also buffs the damage and chip damage of all fireballs, including the last hit of b+3,1,2. Speaking of b+3,1,2, the last hit is +2 block, but every character can armor through the last hit. Some characters with fast armor moves can even armor through the second hit.
Finally, Tanya has an amazing set of wake up attacks. She has access to four armored attacks in Pycromancer - the flip kick, a highly punishable overhead attack that results in an untechable knockdown, the Cammy-esque drill, a highly punishable low attack that launches, the aforementioned EX dark shroud that is safe on block and +50 on hit, and the EX teleport, which hits high but has one hit of armor and can be canceled into another teleport to escape the corner.
@General M2DaveI watched some of your play against Honeybee.
I like what you do, but try to get hitconfirming ex teleports and random air hits down, because air hits go into forward teleport NJP really nicely.
I'm not sure how much you trusted the online connection, but I'm glad you're trying Tanya.
You didn't mention the plus F2 teleport cancels, by the way. Those go into a tick throw or low real nicely for me on block, give those a whirl.
Apparently on Honey Bee's YouTube channel. I had no idea he was recording our online games.
Don't let the fools get early incentives for nerfs. Honey bee played flash and Dvorah. He's a rush down bum. Demand that it be removed.Apparently on Honey Bee's YouTube channel. I had no idea he was recording our online games.
Something I've been doing against teleport characters that use grounded teleports is jump in the air and instead of doing the fire ball Id do the overhead cannon spike attack. The low version is iffy cause of the start up animation is wonky and takes too long to become active.It is too early to discuss match ups, but teleport characters may currently be classified as the most difficult adversaries. I can provide a general gameplay description of Pyromancer, so Tanya players can deduce what works and what does not against each character.
Tanya is a zoning and run away character whose gameplay revolves around the teleport, which is one of the best mobility tools in the game. An instant aerial back teleport is more or less a pre-patch Black Adam backdash that costs no stamina meter. The basic strategy involves running away with back teleports and punishing runs and dashes with grounded fireballs and instant aerial fireballs. The fireballs are non-traditional. Tanya tosses each high and low grounded fireball and each instant aerial high and low fireball at various angles. You have to familiarize yourself with the angles and the space they occupy to avoid getting punished. The EX fireball starts at 9 frames, travels horizontally, and absorbs most other fireballs.
At mid range, you have access to f+2, which is a long-ranged back fist that hits twice. The first hit starts up at 13 frames while the second hits at a much later frame (most likely 20+). f+2 can be safely canceled into the dark shroud, which is -4 on block and around +50 on hit. If the dark shroud connects, a fully charged f+3 cannot be interrupted, which may create a 50/50 mix up with a perfectly run-canceled f+3 into b+3. My execution is not good enough to perform this feat yet, at least not consistently. In addition to being safe and +50 on hit, the EX dark shroud has one hit of armor and is safe on block too. It also buffs the damage and chip damage of all fireballs, including the last hit of b+3,1,2. Speaking of b+3,1,2, the last hit is +2 block, but every character can armor through the last hit. Some characters with fast armor moves can even armor through the second hit.
Finally, Tanya has an amazing set of wake up attacks. She has access to four armored attacks in Pycromancer - the flip kick, a highly punishable overhead attack that results in an untechable knockdown, the Cammy-esque drill, a highly punishable low attack that launches, the aforementioned EX dark shroud that is safe on block and +50 on hit, and the EX teleport, which hits high but has one hit of armor and can be canceled into another teleport to escape the corner.
I can't give you proper game plans on -4 because I'm +9 at the moment. As soon as pc gets up to date I'll be a few weeks and I'll tell you the works with Pyro.Having some trouble against Ermac, MoS variation. Finding it hard to implement any sort of gameplan effectively in Pyro without getting hit some type of way. Anyone with EXP in this MU?
Coincidently, my mediocre Kobu play does almost as good as my very strong Pyro play in this MU so I know something is wrong.
@General M2Dave
@Eddy Wang
@GLoRToR
@Tanya Mains
Well, in Kobu I rush down ermac cause I don't want to give him openings to counter zone with tele or a chance to start his 50/50s. I imagine pyro wants to do the same thing except it's not as solid for rush down. I believe ermac only has one viable wake up so I (and I'm theory fighting here) might try meaty dust on his wake up.Having some trouble against Ermac, MoS variation. Finding it hard to implement any sort of gameplan effectively in Pyro without getting hit some type of way. Anyone with EXP in this MU?
Coincidently, my mediocre Kobu play does almost as good as my very strong Pyro play in this MU so I know something is wrong.
@General M2Dave
@Eddy Wang
@GLoRToR
@Tanya Mains
I didn't tag you because I thought you were on vacation in Antarctica or something lol.Well, in Kobu I rush down ermac cause I don't want to give him openings to counter zone with tele or a chance to start his 50/50s. I imagine pyro wants to do the same thing except it's not as solid for rush down. I believe ermac only has one viable wake up so I (and I'm theory fighting here) might try meaty dust on his wake up.
Between that and f2 tele cancel f2 dust you have good frame control to stay on him. Err or just pick Kobu
Yea but while hiking through the snow I still try to check tym if I can.I didn't tag you because I thought you were on vacation in Antarctica or something lol.
Thanks, I'll give a more aggressive approach a run. Kobu might simply be better for this one though.
What's your 42% for 1 bar?First post. Wooohooo.
Anyway I must say in terms of MU the only true problem I'm having is instant air fans by kitana to punish my attempts at a back teleport after a block string. BTW I'm a day 1 Kitana main.
With the Ermac match up its boiled down to how patient I play and how I abuse Kobujutsu's grotesque options. Luckily it's easy to hit confirm into 42% off one bar.
In closing/nostalgia..picture this my friends.
Subzero uses ice clone from full screen, you instantly run towards him, he charges an ice ball but you simply air flashstep behind him. The moment he throws it you begin your combo. 112-df2-df1-exdf2-NJP-J1, grab. If your lucky it'll be a brutality.