Why use MS 1+3?

[GNG Iniquity]

I don't really see any benefit of it. MS F1 gives you an advantage on block and Sonya does a ridiculous amount of chip while building meter. Am I missing something here?

 

[smokey]

Because once they start blocking low you need to make them pay.

 

[GNG Iniquity]

Because once they start blocking low you need to make them pay.

I'd rather use a F4 though, on hit it gives you +50 advantage (leaves them standing too) and it's neutral on block. MS 1+3 is -3 frames on block. 4% damage difference. Just seems like it isn't very worth while to me.

 

[smokey]

I'd rather use a F4 though, on hit it gives you +50 advantage (leaves them standing too) and it's neutral on block. MS 1+3 is -3 frames on block. 4% damage difference. Just seems like it isn't very worth while to me.

Every time you enter military stance you can go high, mid, low or cancel out into further pressure. If you end a combo in MS and use F1 every time you arent abusing your mixups. The whole point of the MS mixup is that its a mixup, and you make opponents respect that mixup, so they shit their pants every time you enter military stance.
The more unpredictable you play as well the better your outcome, after a f4 on hit you get a safe jump which you can hit confirm into a combo / stance mixup, and if your mixup is only coming as f1 every time you arent playing her stance right, and you wont cause enough salt.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

Cancelling into f4 can be beaten by most moves/jumped, and you shouldnt use MsF1 on blockstrings because that can be jumped/beat by moves like Cages F3. Tackle cant be jumped/poked

On blockstrings use b4 and tackle. If they roll from the tackle its another d4msf1, if they stay put its a cross over, etc.

 

[smokey]

Cancelling into f4 can be beaten by most moves/jumped, and you shouldnt use MsF1 on blockstrings because that can be jumped/beat by moves like Cages F3. Tackle cant be jumped/poked

On blockstrings use b4 and tackle. If they roll from the tackle its another d4msf1, if they stay put its a cross over, etc.

Just for the record whats 114 MS tackle like on block, the recovery doesnt ever seem like they can do anything other than maybe get a free block pressure, but thats if they are fast...

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

Just for the record whats 114 MS tackle like on block, the recovery doesnt ever seem like they can do anything other than maybe get a free block pressure, but thats if they are fast...

Its safe and because Sonya 1 of the lowest hitboxes some characters will have trouble returning normals, like KL or Jax for example

 

[smokey]

Its safe and because Sonya 1 of the lowest hitboxes some characters will have trouble returning normals, like KL or Jax for example

I usually just stand up and mash 1 after a blocked tackle, that has its way with most characters.

Last question, after you cancel into MS, is it usually a good idea to wait before you pick an option, i get quite a lot of success watching people squirm and then judging what to do after a second or two than just mashing b4/tackle/cancel as soon as the MS is up, it seems like they wouldnt have time to react to your mixup even if they wanted to so its sort of counter productive.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

I usually just stand up and mash 1 after a blocked tackle, that has its way with most characters.

Last question, after you cancel into MS, is it usually a good idea to wait before you pick an option, i get quite a lot of success watching people squirm and then judging what to do after a second or two than just mashing b4/tackle/cancel as soon as the MS is up, it seems like they wouldnt have time to react to your mixup even if they wanted to so its sort of counter productive.

Depends what the players like, I'm an asshole and I'll always challenge it, as Cage at least. If I know the Sonya player does F1 off of block strings, that means I can mash F3 and means that they have to do the tackle because they cant cancel or jump.

But I'd say choose overhead or low, then think about what you're going to do on block or hit for both situations before you finish the blockstring.

 

[GamerBlake90]

It's part of Sonya's great mix-ups. The tackle is faster compared to the f4 overhead, which I wouldn't really rely on. I haven't ever been punished for a blocked tackle, though it could be due to the online delay...I dunno.

You can also just cancel out of the stance and go into a throw or more blockstring pressure. The biggest hole to Sonya's mix-up tactics is the fact that a correct guess on her part will knock down the target, and from there they can surprise her with a Wake-Up if she's not careful. These mix-ups are a double-edged sword.

 

[smokey]

Depends what the players like, I'm an asshole and I'll always challenge it, as Cage at least. If I know the Sonya player does F1 off of block strings, that means I can mash F3 and means that they have to do the tackle because they cant cancel or jump.

But I'd say choose overhead or low, then think about what you're going to do on block or hit for both situations before you finish the blockstring.

I usually take a poke or two with the f1 after a d4 ms, other than that i usually would go b21xxMS then wait like a second
if they try to move i can tackle, if they dont i b4, and if they are just lemons then i can cross over, all dependant on what they do in that split second before i push a button.

Some people are dicks though, like you said, and will just not give anything away and just rush you on reaction to MS, but if i survived long enough to notice you mashing f3 out of MS cancels then i guess backdash or armoured cartwheel would be in order, but again thats speculation, in a match it would just be nutpunch into nutpunch as soon as the first MS came out, which is a problem obviously...

 

[Death]

OP, are you crazy. The overhead tackle is so good.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

15% unbreakable damage, if its off of a JIP blockstring (114 or B21) its 20% damage and put them just outside D4 range.

 

[smokey]

Is there ever a point to not doing the extention on the tackle, makes no sense to me why you wouldnt take the extra damage....

 

[GNG Iniquity]

Is there ever a point to not doing the extention on the tackle, makes no sense to me why you wouldnt take the extra damage....

I don't think it's deliberate, I've occasionally missed the 1+2

 

[MoFuzz]

Does anyone else just use the throw button instead of 1+3? I find it more reliable...

 

[Death]

Yeah i use the throw button instead of 1+3 as well. Seems easier imo.

 

[MoFuzz]

Yeah i use the throw button instead of 1+3 as well. Seems easier imo.

But I noticed that if you're using the throw button, you have to mash 1+2 twice. I can never get it to work otherwise.

On the other hand, if I use 1+3 as the tackle starter, hitting 1+2 just once works. Weird.

 

[greeneless]

Does anyone else just use the throw button instead of 1+3? I find it more reliable...

Haven't played much sonya but yeah I do that for KL. 24 throw

 

[Error]

But I noticed that if you're using the throw button, you have to mash 1+2 twice. I can never get it to work otherwise.

On the other hand, if I use 1+3 as the tackle starter, hitting 1+2 just once works. Weird.

Weird, I always use throw and I can do the 1+2 no problem. Anyways, it's always good to have your opponent fearing two or more options after a MS, because then they have less time to react to what you do. Especially in the corner that shit's scary.

 

[salvificblood]

Depends what the players like, I'm an asshole and I'll always challenge it, as Cage at least. If I know the Sonya player does F1 off of block strings, that means I can mash F3 and means that they have to do the tackle because they cant cancel or jump.

Can Sub mash 22 then or is it less reliable than Cage's f3?

 

[Somberness]

I'm actually working on finishing her proper cancel advantage right now, should be done soon.

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

Can Sub mash 22 then or is it less reliable than Cage's f3?

Not sure if the 1st 2 will hit her or not

Basically if a Sonya player does 114 on you, they have to cancel into either B4 or a tackle, if they go for F1 you can challenge them.
If the Sonya player cancels into MS from b21 you have to block the F1 because the stun is too long from the B21 compared to the 114

 

[salvificblood]

Not sure if the 1st 2 will hit her or not

Basically if a Sonya player does 114 on you, they have to cancel into either B4 or a tackle, if they go for F1 you can challenge them.
If the Sonya player cancels into MS from b21 you have to block the F1 because the stun is too long from the B21 compared to the 114

I have a hard time recognising her strings in the heatof the moment. Really need to hit practise with her. By the way, my Kitana will be ready for her. You will learn respect! .

 

[A F0xy Grampa]

I respect nothing, especially Kitana