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General/Other - Raiden God of thunder has to stop falling to nerf abyss!!

Derptile

RIP Ex Smash
Fix his mids whiffing, remove his bugs, and fix some combo extenders but that's it. All this talk about his 50/50 game needing to be safe and him needing a 6 frame poke is Lmao-worthy.

There's alot of overreacting in this thread for sure, it's not like he's unviable anymore. I'd say he's still in the top 15.
 
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The PantyChrist

Rest in Pantiez
Has anyone thought of just doing b2 shocker to condition opponents to stand block for f1? Not trying to be a dick, honestly curious, I don't main raiden but he seems like you have to do more conditioning with him now where as before you could just push buttons
 

Iustinus

Deus Fulminatus
Ahh, so that 1 position in standing at that one tournament with shitloads of people there, is what defines whether the character needs buffs or not?

Just ssshhhhh.
I put no meaning into whether top 9 was indicative of him needing buffs or not. I merely stated that he hasn't made top 8 in a long time, which is a statement of fact. That other guy attempted to dispute this statement of fact with irrelevant information.

As has also been stated Raiden was significantly better at that time than he is now so I stand behind my statement. And let's be serious, I'm not setting some insurmountable obstacle to be overcome for this character. All it takes is for some no name like myself to slip into some no name tournament in some no name part of the country and you guys can say I'm wrong.

It hasn't happened yet, but we'll see about the future.
 

BigMilk

Former Divine Power Abuser
Fix his mids whiffing, remove his bugs, and fix some combo extenders but that's it. All this talk about his 50/50 game needing to be safe and him needing a 6 frame poke is Lmao-worthy.

There's alot of overreacting in this thread for sure, it's not like he's unviable anymore. I'd say he's still in the top 15.
In his current state he does need his 6frame poke. Everything has already been taken from him, and a lot of it was just, but now you are saying this character shouldn't be able to punish either. His damage is fine, so changing combo extenders would just warrant more complaints from the community unless it was reverted back to the way it was.
 

BigMilk

Former Divine Power Abuser
Has anyone thought of just doing b2 shocker to condition opponents to stand block for f1? Not trying to be a dick, honestly curious, I don't main raiden but he seems like you have to do more conditioning with him now where as before you could just push buttons
He doesn't have any tools to legitimately condition. B2 had a gap before and it still exists while OS was removed so b2 shocker can be armored.
 

BigMilk

Former Divine Power Abuser
He doesn't have any tools to legitimately condition. B2 had a gap before and it still exists while OS was removed so b2 shocker can be armored.
Also conditioning someone for f1 is pointless. It's negative and only upside is 6frames and meter build if you finish string
 

Nivek

Athena guide me, the thunder God...
Btw thanks for the interest guys!
@Nivek how has your experience been since these nerfs......as in how much harder do you have to work with him now? just curious
My experience yesterday after some matches with @Metzos and @Cimmerian *cough 7 hours* , our reports are:

6f is still on of his best tools and should still remain a high!
comparing to many characters he lacks neutral game (his best mid is still njp)
his electric string should get their damage back..corner combo b1122 ,f12b2 f12b2 f14 27hits 16%!!(yes this is his best combo from this string lol)
his wake up suck because are high and the only mid(ex db3) scales like crazy best combo 25%...and is hella punishable

they nerfed him because of OS..he needs some stuff back or some small changes..the other 2 variations R.I.P.
 

haketh

Noob
B11 and B34 definitely need to be fixed but y'all need to learn to confirm B2 first hit into shocker if blocked. It's hard but we have Raiden's here that are learning it. Raiden is still a solid ass character in TG and Displacer.

Oh yeah and B11 damage a bit higher, I don''t get why that got hit hard with so much scaling.
 

Frizen

Noob
U cant confirm b+2 into shocker on block. Best u can do is look if someone is ducking or not before 1st hit but opponent can always change his stance frame or few before it hits.
 

Derptile

RIP Ex Smash
U cant confirm b+2 into shocker on block. Best u can do is look if someone is ducking or not before 1st hit but opponent can always change his stance frame or few before it hits.
Buffer the the motion for shocker during the B2, if it's blocked then press 2, if not then let the second hit come out.

It's not easy in any sense, but you can learn it if you take the time(impossible online though).
 

Frizen

Noob
How big is the window where u can cancel b+2 after it hits? Im not at home, but I honestly doubt that its ~15 frames or bigger to be done consistently.
 

Wetdoba

All too easy...
Raiden's F4 goes half screen, low crushes and is 100% safe

F2 2+4 is an advancing mid that is plus

He has 3 different EX specials that launch for a combo on reaction to your opponent jumping

EX superman can punish projectiles and put opponent in the corner on reaction

Displacer has its teleports and Thunder God has half screen multihitting lighting attacks that anti air and can be conformed into superman for instant corner carry

WTF is all this talk about Raiden struggling in the neutral

And like others have said, if you dont have the balls to commit to his overhead for big damage, then B2 shocker is still safe and good for conditioning and opening them up for the low or grab. Seriously people, enough downplay is enough
 

A F0xy Grampa

Problem X Promotions
NO HELL NO. Leave it high and tell the Raiden players to level up. I main him and most raiden mains space horriblely because of that luxury at the release of the game. He need the 6f high if you make it a 9f mid you'll hate life... just a heads up. Maybe ex shocker should hit mid? just maybe lol
Why would anybody hate having a 9f, 9f mids in this game are good things to have.

He might lose a 6f punish, but look at KL, his fastest mid is 11, his fastest high is 8 and he has no 6f punisher, does fine without it.

Now imagine if Raiden retained his 9f mid and still has his 5050s, just the threat of having a mid in some situations will make his 5050s more applicable.

Anybody that says Raiden doesn't struggle in neutral is wrong, it's not even opinion it's fact, you can't play neutral all that well in this game with just highs and slow low pokes, and he doesn't have anything else to cover up that hole.
 

Asodimazze

https://twitter.com/AlfioZacco
Raiden's F4 goes half screen, low crushes and is 100% safe

F2 2+4 is an advancing mid that is plus

He has 3 different EX specials that launch for a combo on reaction to your opponent jumping

EX superman can punish projectiles and put opponent in the corner on reaction

Displacer has its teleports and Thunder God has half screen multihitting lighting attacks that anti air and can be conformed into superman for instant corner carry

WTF is all this talk about Raiden struggling in the neutral

And like others have said, if you dont have the balls to commit to his overhead for big damage, then B2 shocker is still safe and good for conditioning and opening them up for the low or grab. Seriously people, enough downplay is enough
Last time I checked f4 was punishable
 

Dizzy

False Information Police Officer
Premium Supporter
NetherRealm Studios
Why would anybody hate having a 9f, 9f mids in this game are good things to have.

He might lose a 6f punish, but look at KL, his fastest mid is 11, his fastest high is 8 and he has no 6f punisher, does fine without it.

Now imagine if Raiden retained his 9f mid and still has his 5050s, just the threat of having a mid in some situations will make his 5050s more applicable.

Anybody that says Raiden doesn't struggle in neutral is wrong, it's not even opinion it's fact, you can't play neutral all that well in this game with just highs and slow low pokes, and he doesn't have anything else to cover up that hole.
KL does have a -7 punisher, it's one of the best! EX spin!

Just wanted to agree that making f1 a 9f mid would most likely be a buff because he could play footsies with it then, and Raiden could still have a fast punish with 11 which is a 7f normal starter.
 

Wetdoba

All too easy...
Why would anybody hate having a 9f, 9f mids in this game are good things to have.

He might lose a 6f punish, but look at KL, his fastest mid is 11, his fastest high is 8 and he has no 6f punisher, does fine without it.

Now imagine if Raiden retained his 9f mid and still has his 5050s, just the threat of having a mid in some situations will make his 5050s more applicable.

Anybody that says Raiden doesn't struggle in neutral is wrong, it's not even opinion it's fact, you can't play neutral all that well in this game with just highs and slow low pokes, and he doesn't have anything else to cover up that hole.
B1 is an 8 frame mid, F2 and F2 2+4 are both advancing mids that are plus 2 on block. Those are his mids, he already has them, Raiden players just arent happy enough with that though, they are so used to doing nothing but F12 from vanilla days that they think that is the only string he has and claim he has no mids
 

BigMilk

Former Divine Power Abuser
B1 is an 8 frame mid, F2 and F2 2+4 are both advancing mids that are plus 2 on block. Those are his mids, he already has them, Raiden players just arent happy enough with that though, they are so used to doing nothing but F12 from vanilla days that they think that is the only string he has and claim he has no mids
Actually they play the character and understand his issues. B11 still randomly whiffs randomly at point blank range. F2 also is 14frames (not exactly the fastest). It's not plus in TG. And he gets nothing from being advantage. No one is downplaying, it seems you just are on the outside looking in. The best representatives for the character (Nivek, Dizzy & Digit) all say his neutral is weak. Not saying that because they say it, it's set in stone but they have played him at the highest level and have the best results which means their opinion should hold some weight. Anyone that plays Raiden can see this.
 

Youphemism

Gunslinger since pre patch (sh/out to The Farmer)
B1 is an 8 frame mid, F2 and F2 2+4 are both advancing mids that are plus 2 on block. Those are his mids, he already has them, Raiden players just arent happy enough with that though, they are so used to doing nothing but F12 from vanilla days that they think that is the only string he has and claim he has no mids
Yeah because the Raiden players have been saying they just do F12 all day and he has no mids #FailFish. If you actually read the thread you'd see they've said B1 and F2 still have low profiling issues. If they couldn't be low profiled I'd see your point but you are not seeing their point, instead you're just trying to find an excuse to blow them up for no reason.
 

BlackJackSnack

Bags of mostly water
Option selects being removed, fine

F1 being a high, fine its still good for punishing and leads to corner carry

F4 being plus, who cares it's still slow as balls

His mids are still slow and don't lead into what they need and if you use f2,4 RC or b11 RC to set up a 5050 you still run the risk of running out of stamina making his combos having decent damage.

Ex shocker should stay high in my opinion, it is one of the best anti airs in the game. Plus you have ex db3 which hits mid and leads to 24 percent with corner carry.

In my opinion I would just like faster downpokes, not sure how much faster just something to not let him get bullied when someone is in your face.

He is still good character and is still awesome in the corner, however he does have weakness in the neutral and if you disagree you do not play the character.