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MKX AntiAirs: Which characters cannot Anti Air in Mkx

Matix218

Get over here!
Oh you mean like that, well it depends on what character you're using and just how close the jump in came to hitting.

If Kano(godtier backdash) backdashes Liu Kang(doodoo jumpins) jumpin then he'd most likely be too far to run in and punish.
If Kenshi(doodoo backdash) somehow backdashes Kung Lao(godtier times 5 jumpins) then he'd probably be able to immediately punish without even running in.

It's never a good idea to hold block in neutral for this game, you should always be moving around. Walking back is a great way to feel which AA you need, you can see whether or not the Jump-in will whiff so you can tripguard and punish, or you could armor, standing jab, or just backdash depending on the MU.
Has anyone done a tutorial on trip guarding jump ins in this game? I use scorpion, sub zero and kano. Lets say im at jump range and I see my opponent jump, what would I use to effectively trip guard my opponent? The way I understand it, trip guarding is simply hitting the opponent as they land from their jump in. (Be it a low poke like d3/4 or sweep or whatever). How is the best way to actually pull this off consistently?

@Slips
@Pig Of The Hut
@G4S J360
 

Derptile

RIP Ex Smash
Has anyone done a tutorial on trip guarding jump ins in this game? I use scorpion, sub zero and kano. Lets say im at jump range and I see my opponent jump, what would I use to effectively trip guard my opponent? The way I understand it, trip guarding is simply hitting the opponent as they land from their jump in. (Be it a low poke like d3/4 or sweep or whatever). How is the best way to actually pull this off consistently?

@Slips
@pigofthehut
@G4S J360
They jump, they whiff their jump in(from you being out of range or low profiling), and you punish them with full combo.

Walking back, backdashing, dashing, run under, and low profiling are the primary ways of trip guarding. It's obviously different per character.
 

EMPEROR PRYCE

WAR SEASON "THE WEAK EXPOSED!"
Has anyone done a tutorial on trip guarding jump ins in this game? I use scorpion, sub zero and kano. Lets say im at jump range and I see my opponent jump, what would I use to effectively trip guard my opponent? The way I understand it, trip guarding is simply hitting the opponent as they land from their jump in. (Be it a low poke like d3/4 or sweep or whatever). How is the best way to actually pull this off consistently?

@Slips
@Pig Of The Hut
@G4S J360

Best way to trip guard is normally off of a reaction.

Seeing the jump, understanding the range and seeing if it will whiff. Then having your normal out right BEFORE they land, because of start up frames.

Finding the best trip guard is as easy as labbing it up. Some people find it easier with certain strings.
 

Matix218

Get over here!
Best way to trip guard is normally off of a reaction.

Seeing the jump, understanding the range and seeing if it will whiff. Then having your normal out right BEFORE they land, because of start up frames.

Finding the best trip guard is as easy as labbing it up. Some people find it easier with certain strings.
I gotcha, I see @SonicFox5000 do this quite often with erron black actually
 

EMPEROR PRYCE

WAR SEASON "THE WEAK EXPOSED!"
I think if this game wasn't supposed to have consistent anti airs... Then they wouldn't mention it so often. "So and so move is a good anti air" my ass.

Sure not every jump in should get anti aired, which is true. And sure some characters need to be more dominant in the air than others for balance sake, that's true as well. But what I'm getting at and is anti air options in this game are more read based then reactionary.

I have no problem anti airing as Takeda (anymore atleast, spent last 3 weeks focusing on nothing but anti airs, used to suck at it) but its character specific definitely.
 

GAV

Resolution through knowledge and resolve.
MK is supposed to have consistent anti airs, imo, from normals and certain specials. NRS doesn't want to make them consistent in their games because they don't want people turtling with them, but when they were actively copying most of the moves from SF(like almost every fighting game did) they did have very consistent anti airs from MK1-MK3.

If jump-ins are strong in NRS games then it's because they want novice players to not feel constrained by the 2d environment. It seems that for a novice player jumping is an intuitive strategy for attacking someone. NRS doesn't want to take this away and risk having casual players decide that NRS games aren't fun. If you think about it, of the popular games to choose from, only fighting games allow your opponent to control your offensive options while seemingly doing "nothing"(turtling, zoning, waiting to anti air, playing footsies, protecting life lead). Were a gamer to choose Madden, 2k, or an fps game instead of a fg with strong AA, they might get killed in competition but they would always get an opportunity to play offense. 2d fighting games are kind of like the equivalent of make it take it in sports, where whoever scores maintains possession of offense.
Actually, most of MK's animations were taken from a plethora of real fighting styles. Each fighter's hand to hand moves are representative of existing moves within a real style.

SF took moves from just a few styles and filled everyone's move-sets with them.

If someone throws a jumping attack at you when you're on the ground in real life, are you going to try to meet it at the point of attack - or are you going to do something else?

Street Fighter logic doesn't match up to real life logic. MK does a much better job at matching up with real logic.

Most players want what they want though and think they should dictate how things are as opposed to learning how things are.

{MK is "supposed" to have consistent anti-airs.}

Well, it does. It just doesn't fit into the narrow scope of your limited vision.

Git Gud.
 
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The Farmer

Gunslinger since pre ptch -Shout out 2 Youphs 2015
I hear that Erron Black can't AA, and that standing 1 is bad. I honestly don't see it myself.
Whoever said standing 1 is bad is wrong. It's decent enough to use especially for cross ups as well as d1. I play gunslinger so take a grain a salt for what I'm about to say, but this is what I use. Premptivley I use coin toss, sand gust, b2, and sos4 & sos2 on a read. On reaction my only real option is s1 or b1, D1 on a cross up. For me standing 2 into 21122 string only works if the jump in is at max range, if they are in tight on the jump in without crossing up the 2 will profile under and whiff. I've never hit b4 ever in game or used it for that matter. I will test this because I trust pigs opinion and I will give it a look. Never used slide, I feel like that would just coast under most jump ins unless it's at max range. I will test this as well.
 

GhosT

Noob
This is all nonsense to me. The anti airs aren't the problem cuz technically any character has an as in a certain situation. I don't count a trade as an anti air tho. And what aa doesn't always aa there are consistency problems with it. I see the same offline players get an aa or trade and lose on exact same scenario 10 seconds later that's what is goofy about it.
 

Qwark28

Joker waiting room
you mean like a shoryuken???
Do you know how easy it is to bait someone who only uses DPs to anti air in SF4?

Tons of jump ranges where it'll whiff, go the wrong way, have to be autocorrected too fast to be consistent etc.

You have to be able to anti air with multiple moves in SF4 if you want to keep most of the cast honest in that game. Good Ryu players anti air with all 3 DP strengths, st hk and cr hp depending on the situation.

Close range, jump distance, midscreen jumps, crossups, safejumps that are escapable with low profile normals and more.
 

Matix218

Get over here!
Actually, most of MK's animations were taken from a plethora of real fighting styles. Each fighter's hand to hand moves are representative of existing moves within a real style.

SF took moves from just a few styles and filled everyone's move-sets with them.

If someone throws a jumping attack at you when you're on the ground in real life, are you going to try to meet it at the point of attack - or are you going to do something else.

Street Fighter logic doesn't match up to real life logic. MK does a much better job at matching up with real logic.

Most players want what they want though and think they should dictate how things are as opposed to learning how things are.

{MK is "supposed" to have consistent anti-airs.}

Well, it does. It just doesn't fit into the narrow scope of your limited vision.

Git Gud.
Lol could you imagine actually trying to standing jab a heavy human jump kicking you in real life
 
Reactions: GAV
Do you know how easy it is to bait someone who only uses DPs to anti air in SF4?

Tons of jump ranges where it'll whiff, go the wrong way, have to be autocorrected too fast to be consistent etc.

You have to be able to anti air with multiple moves in SF4 if you want to keep most of the cast honest in that game. Good Ryu players anti air with all 3 DP strengths, st hk and cr hp depending on the situation.

Close range, jump distance, midscreen jumps, crossups, safejumps that are escapable with low profile normals and more.

yes i do i used far heavy kicks, crouching hp, i've seen ryus light kick dive kicks to stuff them, shoryukens against chars like vega. shoryuken is still universally amazing as an aa and outpriorities everything, obv. if your spacing is bad its diff.
 

Rude

You will serve me in The Netherrealm
d1's are old meta for mk9. The universal anti airs were standing jabs when the metagame evolved.
Not every character's stand jabs were effective for that purpose.

And even late in the game's life, d1s were still used for anti cross ups. It all depended on the character you played.

Kind of like now, actually.
 

Slips

Feared by dragons. Desired by virgins.
In MKX you have much less options to AA on reaction. The success rate is much lower and risk vs. reward is very high for many characters. If you don't use meter, you are at risk of eating a full combo, where in SFIV, at least you trade and you are reset back to neutral.

I'm not saying SFIV is a better game because of it, but at least if you made the choice to watch out for jump ins, you could successfully AA and play some defense. At the very least, you could focus attack and absorb the hit into backdash.
I think it's the same but the fact there is a run in MKX means jumps can take you by surprise more. That and the fact transitioning from block to an AA takes a bit more time.

MKX just being a faster game in general makes it seem like AA'ing is harder.
 

The Farmer

Gunslinger since pre ptch -Shout out 2 Youphs 2015
General consensus among the Erron Black community.
I just feel for some people to flat out say it's bad is a bit too harsh. It's effective at least somewhat consistently on cross ups, Gun Show has displayed this in a lot of his matches.
 

WakeUp DP

GT MK OshTekk.
Thanks for taking your time and try helping us out. You have a good point by backdashing you can avoid cross ups but not jump ins. The range on most jump attacks are too big that even if you backdash you still get hit out of it, also the invincibility on back dash is very short.
Buff the invincibility and make it cover more range.

Now onto strings, you can not whiff punish most strings in this game cause they cover a lot of screen. An EH backdash that required 2 bars of stamina would solve this problem, give it faster recovery and more invincibility.
 

NYCj360

i Use a modded cyber now
Thanks for taking your time and try helping us out. You have a good point by backdashing you can avoid cross ups but not jump ins. The range on most jump attacks are too big that even if you backdash you still get hit out of it, also the invincibility on back dash is very short.
Buff the invincibility and make it cover more range.

Now onto strings, you can not whiff punish most strings in this game cause they cover a lot of screen. An EH backdash that required 2 bars of stamina would solve this problem, give it faster recovery and more invincibility.
Do you have any jump ins in particular? I tested it against kotal and cassie and was able to backdash pretty consistently. I may be wrong about it, but i haven't run into one i couldn't backdash yet.