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Rank the top 10 zoning variations in order

NHDR

NHDR

Noob
I'm sooooooooo glad nobody listened to all the day 1 whiners who said that Cybernetic Kano was S-tier and should have his knife frame data altered. The game matured and suddenly he's not even a top 5 zoner.
 
Big Pampering

Big Pampering

Noob
I feel like kenshi in mkx is an incomplete character. Especially if you knew how to play mk9 kenshi that character felt really complete and maybe was a little too good, but some tweaks would have made him fair already. He just feels so meter dependant in this game and I feel like he doesnt have the normals to back up his gameplan in mk9 he had a 1 hit overhead that did decent damage for footsies and he had a very long range low string. Spirit charge got way overnerfed imo.
 
Orochi

Orochi

Scorpion Scrub
Metzos said:
1) Kenjutsu mix ups are easy to see. Just block low, since b3 is 11f and if you see b2, which is 18f, you block high, same with BS Shinnok mix ups.

2) Why would you zone with bf3 and not with db4?

3) Possessed Kenshi builds good meter, i dont know what you are talking about. Also Possessed Kenshi deals the same ammount of damage with two bars (45% dmg) as Kenjutsu Kenshi and with 1 bar he deals 37% dmg IIRC, without a jump in punch. Thats not mediocre damage lol. Also his d2 and njp are great AA's against almost everyone, i dont know why no one mentions this.

4) Kenjutsu has the best mix ups, yes, but read sentence no1.

5) Ex teleport also has armor if the opponent likes to press buttons like an idiot while he is pressuring Possessed Kenshi.

I ve been playing Kenshi since day 1 and my opinion still stands. NRS put a zoner in a game where zoners are not allowed. Pig is right. I also agree that, at the moment, Possessed Kenshi is the best variation in almost all of Kenshi's MU's.

Kenjutsu would be viable if bf3 was a mid again, but that would incite too much salt even among top players, which i find logical. Imo they need to reduce the recovery frames on whiff on Balance and Kenjutsu Kenshi's bf3's in order for them to become viable zoners. Possessed is fine atm IMO.
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1. easy to see :p you must have godlike reactions. Its actually hard to react unless you fuzzy guard which you delay the low instead.

2. Same thing people will run through db4 or bf3 thats why its not viable zoning.

3. All variations reach that dmg with one bar easy. Can you give an example of meterless bnbs midscreen that are over 25% in possessed without njp? All variations build around the same meter its still no kung lao to have meter to spend on all that i mentioned.

4. See #1

5. Ex teleport is good, so is ex tele slam, ex rk. And you still get lower dmg unless u spend 2 bars but with possessed meter building i guess this is no problem huh?

Ive been playing kenshi day one as well, and agree that zoners are weak in this game.

As far as possessed i disagree, and its funny how some players agree just because pig says its the best. Pig said as well balanced and kenjutsu was best at one point and kenshi was top 5 after buffs (everyone was agreeing then too lol)

And yes kenjutsu is viable bf3 is a punishing tool, kenjutsu is not a zoner not sure why people want to zome by spamming bf3s in kenjutsu lol.
 
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DET_BLAKEANATOR

DET_BLAKEANATOR

Noob
Pig Of The Hut said:
But I win more w possessed

Meter building is actually good , better damage, no -51/-53 whiffed moves, safer sc, safer rk, resets, safe 50/50s. Better and safer spacing

The more I play all 3 the less I'm finding that's good w balance
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Kitanas fan should be -50 on whiff, that's only fair right!? If kenshi has no mix up game like kitana (EXTREME AIR QUOTES) y can she recover so fast nrs? Why make kenshi so punishable??? Or fix that shit one or the other
 
Metzos

Metzos

You will BOW to me!
Orochi said:
1. easy to see :p you must have godlike reactions. Its actually hard to react unless you fuzzy guard which you delay the low instead.

2. Same thing people will run through db4 or bf3 thats why its not viable zoning.

3. All variations reach that dmg with one bar easy. Can you give an example of meterless bnbs midscreen that are over 25% in possessed without njp? All variations build around the same meter its still no kung lao to have meter to spend on all that i mentioned.

4. See #1

5. Ex teleport is good, so is ex tele slam, ex rk. And you still get lower dmg unless u spend 2 bars but with possessed meter building i guess this is no problem huh?

Ive been playing kenshi day one as well, and agree that zoners are weak in this game.

As far as possessed i disagree, and its funny how some players agree just because pig says its the best. Pig said as well balanced and kenjutsu was best at one point and kenshi was top 5 after buffs (everyone was agreeing then too lol)

And yes kenjutsu is viable bf3 is a punishing tool, kenjutsu is not a zoner not sure why people want to zome by spamming bf3s in kenjutsu lol.
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1. I dont, my teammates have, its not that hard to do so.

2. No because you can bait runs or dashes with regulard db4 and close db4.

3. He doesnt but that doesnt mean he needs them.

4. See #1.

5. I really dont care about the damage if i have two ways of getting the opponent off me tbh.

Glad we agree on that one.

I am agreeing with Pig here, simply because he is right. The reason why people agreed with Pig, IN THE EARLY STAGES OF THE GAME, is because no one had explored Kenshi except Pig back then. And no one stayed loyal to Kenshi until the big buffs came pouring in (including myself), except Pig and probably a couple of others. He was THAT bad before the buffs.

Its not my style to dick riding, if that is what you are implying, but it is my style to speak up when i agree with someone's opinions if their facts are straight.
 
Immortal

Immortal

Blind justice....
Orochi said:
1. easy to see :p you must have godlike reactions. Its actually hard to react unless you fuzzy guard which you delay the low instead.

2. Same thing people will run through db4 or bf3 thats why its not viable zoning.

3. All variations reach that dmg with one bar easy. Can you give an example of meterless bnbs midscreen that are over 25% in possessed without njp? All variations build around the same meter its still no kung lao to have meter to spend on all that i mentioned.

4. See #1

5. Ex teleport is good, so is ex tele slam, ex rk. And you still get lower dmg unless u spend 2 bars but with possessed meter building i guess this is no problem huh?

Ive been playing kenshi day one as well, and agree that zoners are weak in this game.

As far as possessed i disagree, and its funny how some players agree just because pig says its the best. Pig said as well balanced and kenjutsu was best at one point and kenshi was top 5 after buffs (everyone was agreeing then too lol)

And yes kenjutsu is viable bf3 is a punishing tool, kenjutsu is not a zoner not sure why people want to zome by spamming bf3s in kenjutsu lol.
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To be clear i also don't think that Possessed is the best Kenshi variation. It's probably Kenjutsu but to be honest it's also overrated. And in overall standing i put Kenjutsu and Possessed pretty close to each other.

People who think Kenshi is top 5 are delusional (i made that clear in first Yomi tier list where DJT putted him on 6th or smtg like that), top 10 is just upplaying. At very best he is top 15 atm and probably gonna fall from it when more weaker characters get buffed. Assuming of course they wont change Kenshi along the way.

Anyway the point is that a top player with Kenshi cannot compete with another top player using top tier characters. That's the problem.

@Metzos i'm playing Kenshi since day one 1 and sticked with him even before the buffs.
 
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A F0xy Grampa

A F0xy Grampa

Problem X Promotions
Scott The Scot said:
Well zoning is about controlling space and her guns make her control the space pretty well. Her guns are armour breaking so the opponent has to duck and slowly advance. Has to. At full-screen she controls the pace of the game and forces the opponent to play her game. That's enough to warrant that she has good zoning in my books. No she's not going to win by just using projectiles or anything but that's not what zoning is about in my opinion. Not everyone can have fast mid hitting knifes :DOGE
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Who gives a shit about Jaquis zoning lol, shes not really got much else to enforce it.
 
Peckapowa

Peckapowa

Noob
EMPEROR_JUPITER said:
I think pumped up jax should be there tbh. Nice and easy AA, nice projectile, plus jax has really good footsies added on top of pumped up giving you good AA and a free OTG when you d2 or hit an airborne char w/ projectile.
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hw i also considered, the cancellability is strong
 
Peckapowa

Peckapowa

Noob
NHDR said:
I'm sooooooooo glad nobody listened to all the day 1 whiners who said that Cybernetic Kano was S-tier and should have his knife frame data altered. The game matured and suddenly he's not even a top 5 zoner.
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tbh he might have top 5 zoning, that projectile is insane, his biggest problem was nerfed, and that is b1
 
Orochi

Orochi

Scorpion Scrub
Metzos said:
1. I dont, my teammates have, its not that hard to do so.

2. No because you can bait runs or dashes with regulard db4 and close db4.

3. He doesnt but that doesnt mean he needs them.

4. See #1.

5. I really dont care about the damage if i have two ways of getting the opponent off me tbh.

Glad we agree on that one.

I am agreeing with Pig here, simply because he is right. The reason why people agreed with Pig, IN THE EARLY STAGES OF THE GAME, is because no one had explored Kenshi except Pig back then. And no one stayed loyal to Kenshi until the big buffs came pouring in (including myself), except Pig and probably a couple of others. He was THAT bad before the buffs.

Its not my style to dick riding, if that is what you are implying, but it is my style to speak up when i agree with someone's opinions if their facts are straight.
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I stayed loyal as well, i was playing raiden but ended up using kenshi at tournaments anyway.

Ive said it before and ill say it again possessed is too meter reliant weak mixups where kenjutsu shines, like pig said possessed has no zoning, trash meterless dmg. You are handicapped playing this variation but you can quote me later on when we all agree again.
 
U

Undergroundepict

I am like the blue rose
Cybernetic Kano is not a top 10 zoner. He really isn't a zoner, period, and trying to play the character as a zoner is doomed to failure.
 
Evil Canadian

Evil Canadian

G O K U
Premium Supporter
Instead I will give some character perspective. Kotal basically gets zoned the hardest out of anyone in the cast due to how he is made, and here are the characters that give him the hardest time with their zoning.

1) HQT
2) HW Jax
3) Pyro Tanya
4) FA Jacqui
5) Shinnok(any ver, hellsparks)
6) RS Kitana

Not going to 10, because the list is basically 6. Anyone else a smidge of patience and a correct jump gets you past everything. Obviously my opinion but thems how I sees it.
 
Vithar

Vithar

Evil but Honest!
Evil Canadian said:
Instead I will give some character perspective. Kotal basically gets zoned the hardest out of anyone in the cast due to how he is made, and here are the characters that give him the hardest time with their zoning.

1) HQT
2) HW Jax
3) Pyro Tanya
4) FA Jacqui
5) Shinnok(any ver, hellsparks)
6) RS Kitana

Not going to 10, because the list is basically 6. Anyone else a smidge of patience and a correct jump gets you past everything. Obviously my opinion but thems how I sees it.
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This is bull****!
 
STB Sgt Reed

STB Sgt Reed

Online Warrior
Evil Canadian said:
Instead I will give some character perspective. Kotal basically gets zoned the hardest out of anyone in the cast due to how he is made, and here are the characters that give him the hardest time with their zoning.

1) HQT
2) HW Jax
3) Pyro Tanya
4) FA Jacqui
5) Shinnok(any ver, hellsparks)
6) RS Kitana

Not going to 10, because the list is basically 6. Anyone else a smidge of patience and a correct jump gets you past everything. Obviously my opinion but thems how I sees it.
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Lol no summoner Quan??

K.
 
Pig Of The Hut

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Orochi said:
Yes I play all variations actually and i've never been a fan of possessed though it's kind of fun. Why anti air with ex rk and get 17% instead of 27% why do 20s meterless midscreen when i can do 30+ I dont know maybe i missed where possessed has good damage midscreen without nj2.

Why pick possessed mixups over kenjutsus, you get like 10% on your overhead special instead of 29% with kenjutsu

Zone with possessed? Theres none just run straight through bf3 will whiff there goes your space control.

You need meter for anti airs, meter for mediocre midscreen dmg, meter for wake up, meter for breaker. Last i heard kenshi was no kung lao.

I just feel like kenjutsu is way ahead in the mixup department, dmg, mtr and meterless dmg and resets.

His combo launcher doesn't even have armor you have to stick to ex rk, do i need to go on?



I must miss those matches then i usually see you win with balanced. Like vs alucard i think you couldve done it with balanced than possessed. You just had to be less predictable with ex rks.

But anyway what do i know i rarely play the game every other weekend and tournaments thx to this trash net code so i only lab it up until i play again.
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Thing is possessed 50/50 is completely safe and is setup off a meter building string 322 or 421 that ends in a guess.

Possessed has a two bar 70% reset that I hit people a lot with and the OH reset I believe is 53% 2 bar

Bf3 is atrocious I agree,seeing people run thru mid special is devastating. In the corner u get much more off of ex db1 and it's a price we pay for it to be safer

Sc being far better has helped a lot in many MUs. I got tired of having my spacing tool punished . U can whiff a db1 most MUs to build meter after bf3

If I block a Lao spin or scorp tele in balance I get 34% in possessed I get 47-49% 2 bar

Kenjutsu if I guess wrong I'm punished,
Possessed I guess wrong I'm safe

D4 df4 is one of his best available footsie options
 
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Evil Canadian

Evil Canadian

G O K U
Premium Supporter
STB Sgt Reed said:
Lol no summoner Quan??

K.
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War god vs Summoner is literally my most played matchup in all of MK.

Summoner zoning not scary, can be a bit annoying, but not scary in the least.


*ed*

And do remember, my post is based on Kotal experience.

Jacqui annoying because you guess right on jumpin, get JIP1, but since kotal's knee sticks out in the animation it gets hit by the 4th bullet and I get no punish. Or guess right on up rocket and run in, but since kotal is so tall he gets hit in the face by it when a smaller character gets under. HQT High shot can occasionally hit a crouching Kotal. These are character specific things and the list is based off that.
 
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Metzos

Metzos

You will BOW to me!
Orochi said:
I stayed loyal as well, i was playing raiden but ended up using kenshi at tournaments anyway.

Ive said it before and ill say it again possessed is too meter reliant weak mixups where kenjutsu shines, like pig said possessed has no zoning, trash meterless dmg. You are handicapped playing this variation but you can quote me later on when we all agree again.
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So? Kenjutsu is meter reliant as well, if you wanna go for damaging combos with meter. Only viable string which leads to average meterless damage in Kenjutsu is 111.

How much damage do you get from b32 in Kenjutsu without meter midscreen? Trash.

How much damage do you get from f2 in Kenjutsu without meter midscreen (except if you commit to db1 after f2 which is highly punishable on block)? Guess what, trash again.

Not to mention that Possessed mix ups are completely safe against the entire cast. I ve posted this before and i ll say it again. I prefer to have safe 50/50's which dont launch, or one of them will launch, WILL BE COMPLETELY SAFE and cost a bar of meter, than unsafe 50/50's which i have to commit to.
 
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Metzos

Metzos

You will BOW to me!
Immortal said:
To be clear i also don't think that Possessed is the best Kenshi variation. It's probably Kenjutsu but to be honest it's also overrated. And in overall standing i put Kenjutsu and Possessed pretty close to each other.

People who think Kenshi is top 5 are delusional (i made that clear in first Yomi tier list where DJT putted him on 6th or smtg like that), top 10 is just upplaying. At very best he is top 15 atm and probably gonna fall from it when more weaker characters get buffed. Assuming of course they wont change Kenshi along the way.

Anyway the point is that a top player with Kenshi cannot compete with another top player using top tier characters. That's the problem.

@Metzos i'm playing Kenshi since day one 1 and sticked with him even before the buffs.
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I know. Thats why i said "Pig and a couple of others". I just couldnt remember your name, i remembered you now from your profile picture.
 
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