Match-Up Discussion - Sonya Blade Sonya vs Scorpion (Single Fight/VERY HARD MODE)

A few things. So I've been practicing since the games release and Im pretty beastly with Sonya. My BNBs are always 34% 40% in all 3 variations. Completing the Klassic Tower on Hard Mode is a cake walk for me.

I havent taken her online yet because I have been studying spam techniques from internet players. Once I have memorized their shady tactics I will be good to go.

So anyway. I've been prepping hard this week to go online. So I currently am fighting Scorpion in a "Single Fight" on Very Hard. I've never had any difficulty like this against ANYONE in the game in any ladder before.

Covert Ops seemed useless. Cant parry because everything he does hits low and by the time hes doing his teleport (the way its supposed to be done, not spammed) you cant parry it because it's mid combo. MS was useless too. Occasionally I would get him with MS-3 but it was rare. Sometimes I can get him with an armored Leg Grab.

So now I'm using Demolition which is currently my favorite, and I dont know why players are afraid of it or havent been able to connect with it. It's excellent especially against incredibly aggressive players. You can throw grenades and detonate them as your opponent tries to start a combo, or you can detonate them mid combo and it's pretty sweet to see. Similar to how in Special Forces enhanced 2 (triangle?) can get them as they are hitting you.

Anyway my fellow Sonya players. I havent beaten Scorpion once today in Very Hard Single Fight mode and I am really irritated. I was wondering if anyone could try it themselves and give me some feedback on if they win? Sharing these tactics will help us overcome anything online.

Fighting vs the ai can only help you so much. I think once you have your movement, bnbs down its time to practice against real people. Online shouldn't be taken as anything bigger than practice/fun Imo

There is little to no point fighting the "very hard" ai. It is more or less "perfect" in a sense that it will react to your moves the very moment you press a button.

But have you tried Sonya vs Scorpion on Very Hard to see what I mean? Im having fun playing AI. Me and my fiance are always fighting eachother too. We just want to get really good and confident before we go online.

This is a great way to build awful habits. You're better off going online.

AI on very hard is unreal, no person is able to play like that.

Vagrant said:

This is a great way to build awful habits. You're better off going online.

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What kind of bad habits should I be weary of?

Yeah Im kinda starting to get that its really unreal. But I have been able to get him to like a quarter of his health remaining. I have to throw a lot of grenades. Sometimes during the match I feel like Im just juggled the entire round as I hold block.

Also guys aother reason I havent taken her online is because I was kinda mad Sony pulled an XBOX and made it so you have to PAY every month to play online. Before I pay to play online I want my technique to be really refined.

playing against AI teaches you next to nothing. You cannot 'mix up' the AI. Anytime the ai gets hit it is because they let you.

The only thing (IMO) that fighting the AI is good for is trying to find/exploit safe attacks/strings. You can't train an AI, or switch tactics and out smart them.

When picking up a new character, I typically play in practice mode for an hour or two, then go up the Klassic Tower (to get the ending), then go into the Endless Tower just to practice my BnB's under some pressure, find a few setups, and see how far I can go up. After that, Online is my next stop.

FYI: Online, people do STUPID things...err, play very stupidly. The best thing online matches (against randoms mind you) can teach you is how to adjust your game to stop stupid tactics, but at the same time online can teach you to do stupid tactics yourself so you have to be careful. I rarely play ranked as I hate single fights (they do nothing really), I mostly play player matches just to get 'back to back' fights against halfway decent players to practice my own tactics, or learn characters / strats that I may not have encountered yet.

i look forward to the day we can code our own bots to be more human like. back in my q3a days there were some fairly human bots that modmakers made..

btw what variation scorpion are you trying to best

podizzler3000 said:

i look forward to the day we can code our own bots to be more human like. back in my q3a days there were some fairly human bots that modmakers made

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Actually, KI is doing something similar to this. You won't be coding your own AI patterns or anything, but their new "Shadows Mode" is suppose to learn your habits and create an custom player AI for each player who plays the game. In theory you will be able to play against any top player, without actually having to play them, in order to up your game. Seems cool, but I'm not sold on it yet to be honest.

The very hard bots are actually better than a vast majority of people I find online. I think it's because 50/50s are useless vs them.

Onilordasmodeus said:

Actually, KI is doing something similar to this. You won't be coding your own AI patterns or anything, but their new "Shadows Mode" is suppose to learn your habits and create an custom player AI for each player who plays the game. In theory you will be able to play against any top player, without actually having to play them, in order to up your game. Seems cool, but I'm not sold on it yet to be honest.

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God damn...

Anyway, OP, if you really care about beating the AI, there's an easy way.

Very hard AI = perfect reaction. Abuse that. In neutral if the AI sees you crouching it will attack with an overhead. If it sees you standing up it will attack with a low. Crouch, wait for a fraction of a second then stand block and punish the overhead. Do the reverse to punish lows. It works like a charm.

Forget AI. You won't learn fotsies, mindgames, mixups, zoning, anti zoning,... Also, to be good online, you will have to learn to adapt to the lag.

I always wonder why the AI in any fighting game sucks so hard. Is it really such a big deal to implement a few frames "reaction time", footsies, practical combos? For two decades we have to suffer from ultra punsihes on pokes, bullshit combos, instant throw tech and what not. And once you find a frame trap, it's good bye AI. Bah it's so annoing.

this is just exactly what i do. i play offline to get good.
I play Ai in very hard mode and i mean YOU CAN NEVER BEAT SCORPION. I had to convince myself that the game was make like that. believe me, when u can get him atleast but neve beat him, you are good to go online

i can spank any AI on very hard using raiden. so its possible. corrupted shinnok on very hard is a big ole ho though. sonya is a top tier player imo so it shouldnt be much different.

unfortunately as a pc player the AI is a good option to online.

stevoforce.mk said:

this is just exactly what i do. i play offline to get good.
I play Ai in very hard mode and i mean YOU CAN NEVER BEAT SCORPION. I had to convince myself that the game was make like that. believe me, when u can get him atleast but neve beat him, you are good to go online

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you can beat scorpion because he is an AI. just like old MK's you have to trick the system in to think you are doing something only to bait out a reaction and punish, in this case pressing one button and canceling into another action reproduces these results. if you press you buttons fast enough in sequence you will see the AI do some weird shit lol.

Zyphox said:

you can beat scorpion because he is an AI. just like old MK's you have to trick the system in to think you are doing something only to bait out a reaction and punish, in this case pressing one button and canceling into another action reproduces these results. if you press you buttons fast enough in sequence you will see the AI do some weird shit lol.

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pls make a video on it then, i would love to watch & learn

All of this in a nutshell: AI is great to fight a few times on a high difficulty a few times because it teaches you what strings of yours have gaps (if there's a gap they'll armor through that shit every time) itll help you with reaction speed, and it'll teach you to maximize damage on punishes because the AI will make you pay more for dropping a combo than most the people you'll find online. Also gives you the chance to get an idea of what some of the lesser used cast can do, personally I had never fought a D'vorah online and when I first did I got wrecked cuz all I had seen was Scorpions, Cassie's, you can probably guess the rest. So I fought very hard AI D'voeah about five times and the next time it one I had a much better experience