General/Other - Raiden Raiden General Discussion

I'm not seeing how this technique makes the cancel easier?

By holding block in advance, you are creating one more opportunity to drop the combo, because if you press block at the wrong time you will get a regular dash instead of a run.

F F+RT eliminates this possibility.

My advice is to work on the easier LRC combos first, because some of them are WAY more difficult than others.

NjP F2 B14 LRC 214 is actually quite easy. Practice this one first in order to get a feel for the timing of everything and build your muscle memory. I can do this combo online 100% of the time and I've only been playing Raiden for 2 days. (My execution sucks btw).

After you have that one mastered, move on to 34 RUN B14 LRC F12B2 and then 34 RUN B14 LRC 214

Once you can do those consistently, you'll be where I am. I'm working on B32[3] RUN B14 LRC F12B2 right now and it's a huge pain in my ass.

What helped me the most was learning to input the F F+RT at the right time. At first, I was buffering it, but then I had to wait 5-6 frames for Raiden to 'create' the ball of lightning before he starts running. This was forcing me to visually wait for him to start running before I input the next string, and it was resulting in dropped combos.

To fix this problem, I started to wait for him to create the ball of lightning, and then I would time my F F+RT so that it landed on the same frame as the cancel frame. So it's B14 DB1 "wait for him to create lightning" F F+RT 214

Oh btw, for anyone that missed NLBC last night. Arturo Sanchez was trying to do LRC's the entire tournament, and he was missing 99% of them.

Even while constantly dropping these combos, he still made it to grand finals. (Goes to show how strong Raiden is)

Anyway Art is a fighting game pro, and he obviously can't do lightning cancels, so if you're having trouble, don't feel bad

Keep seeing my ex lightning hit twice for 18% or get blocked, pushes them back and yet the lightning still stays there, this could really be abused and needs to go.

Chaosphere said:

Yeah I've been playing with ex-lightning for the last couple weeks or so. Sometimes on knockdown, I'll throw the ex-lightning out, stop it right in front of them, and run at them. At this point I try to react to whatever they do. If it hits, I cancel the run with a njp into full combo for big damage. However, I haven't found a rock solid setup for this and it's way more viable in the corner as opposed to midscreen.

Midscreen will work... but they can also just walk back and you wasted a bar of meter for nothing. But in the corner... you can go for your 50/50.... or you can throw them into the ex-lightning which causes you to fall down, where you can tech roll into superman for something like 22%. It works just like sub's clone does but just doesn't last as long.

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I have

Cerebru said:

I have

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Prove it. Talk about it instead of hiding everything. What's the point of even coming in to say you've found something if you're not going to share it? You looking for props from everyone here for finding something that you won't tell any of us about? I'm really not trying to be a dick, but this whole mentality is extremely annoying and doesn't help anyone. Not even yourself. By not talking about it.. you don't have extra eyes on it to help out with finding counters to it that maybe you haven't thought of.

A couple of ideas for mid screen EX lightning setup in MoS (can't test it at work). With one trap out, Ex lightning, trap, njp, *insert combo here. Or EX lightning, electrocute, complete trap, 34, njp, *insert combo here.

infamy23 said:

Oh btw, for anyone that missed NLBC last night. Arturo Sanchez was trying to do LRC's the entire tournament, and he was missing 99% of them.

Even while constantly dropping these combos, he still made it to grand finals. (Goes to show how strong Raiden is)

Anyway Art is a fighting game pro, and he obviously can't do lightning cancels, so if you're having trouble, don't feel bad

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So is it really some tight just frame timing to get these off properly? If so and it's not just a case of me doing it wrong, I'll probably just give up on them and do regular combos, especially with the scaling changes.

Cerebru said:

I have[/QUOT

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Chaosphere said:

Prove it. Talk about it instead of hiding everything. What's the point of even coming in to say you've found something if you're not going to share it? You looking for props from everyone here for finding something that you won't tell any of us about? I'm really not trying to be a dick, but this whole mentality is extremely annoying and doesn't help anyone. Not even yourself. By not talking about it.. you don't have extra eyes on it to help out with finding counters to it that maybe you haven't thought of.

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You still have yet to add me. There is a lot of stuff thats out that I didn't know before Texas Showdown... I didn't see anyone posting their strategies. They executed what they felt was liable. So don't be a dick ...

Cerebru said:

You still have yet to add me. There is a lot of stuff thats out that I didn't know before Texas Showdown... I didn't see anyone posting their strategies. They executed what they felt was liable. So don't be a dick ...

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Why don't you just post it here? I don't understand. Those people you're referring to also don't come into the raiden forums to snicker about their setups without telling anybody. I'm really not trying to be a dick. It's just annoying lol

Chaosphere said:

Why don't you just post it here? I don't understand. Those people you're referring to also don't come into the raiden forums to snicker about their setups without telling anybody. I'm really not trying to be a dick. It's just annoying lol

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Word... When does the patch come out for XBL

Cerebru said:

Word... When does the patch come out for XBL

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Good question. I really want to know. Waiting is killing me.

KowtowRobinson said:

So is it really some tight just frame timing to get these off properly? If so and it's not just a case of me doing it wrong, I'll probably just give up on them and do regular combos, especially with the scaling changes.

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It depends which one you're doing.

B23 B14 LRC 214 is a just frame I believe. At least it feels that way to me. Might be a 2 frame window.

But NjP F2 B14 LRC 214 is a very easy link. You are really hurting your Raiden game if you're not using this combo. It gives you 7% extra damage and a bit more corner carry.

Reversal Shocker B14 LRC 214 is also quite easy and comes into play a lot during matches. Again, an extra 7% damage.

Chaosphere said:

Why don't you just post it here? I don't understand. Those people you're referring to also don't come into the raiden forums to snicker about their setups without telling anybody. I'm really not trying to be a dick. It's just annoying lol

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Pretty much this. People with the old school "save that shit for Nationals" mentality aren't the same people coming in here on some "I know something you don't knowwwww, teehee!" bullshit either.

Brief descriptions of Raiden's variations? Highlight their pros and cons.

Phantasmagore said:

Brief descriptions of Raiden's variations? Highlight their pros and cons.

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Thunder God is the most popular at the moment. It adds lots of extra lightning strings which have armor-breaking and combo applications. It also adds Lightning Ball cancel, as well as extra damage to lightning-based attacks (?).

Displacer has the teleport. It's very slow to recover, except for the EX version. Displacer might be worth it against zoners, but it's hard to tell at the moment. For example, if Subzero pulls out a clone out of nowhere, any variation can punish with EX superman, but in Displacer you might be able to EX teleport and full punish.

Master of Storms allows you to set up static lightning balls that stay in place. They don't hit the opponent unless you have two at which point they "connect" with lightning. Once connected, they hit mid. It's a tricky variation based on setups, and it seems like not a lot of good setups have been found so far.

Summary: Thunder God is currently the simplest, most straightforward damage-dealing variation. We may eventually find more uses for Displacer and Master of Storms, but right now their potential seems very limited.

I never knew about the non-scaled shocker bug pre-patch. Its seems to only happen after the opponent is hit by a shocker after a b14 restand and not relaunched.

Kinda sad for Displacer because that was the only way EX Teleport combos could almost keep up with EX Shocker combos.

You can use lighting stop on people that are trying to jump in over your projectiles. Once they jump on it you can run in and combo.

Or you can use it as a pressuring tool. Jump over them Block string they eat it. Free combo

Anyone know what determines scaling? Is it number of hits, moves or % damage dealt?

Versing raiden the cheap Fuck and can't get a hit in block his same combos and counter but he still has time block are you fucking joking

Style_Balls said:

Versing raiden the cheap Fuck and can't get a hit in block his same combos and counter but he still has time block are you fucking joking

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We're sorry. Right now we're busy with our other customers. If you would like to express more salt, press (1). If you would like to cry nerf, press (2). If you would like help leveling up, press (3). For these and more options press (4).

Style_Balls said:

Versing raiden the cheap Fuck and can't get a hit in block his same combos and counter but he still has time block are you fucking joking

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There are a few things you can against lightning when you block it. Here are the following frames on block when you block the full lightning strings:

f1,2,b2 (hold for 4 charges) = -8 on block
b3,2 (Hold for 4 charges) = -6 on block (might be wrong on the frames of this as well)
1,1,2 (Hold for 4 charges) = -14 on block (might be wrong as well but I know this string is punishable)
f2, 2+4 (Hold for 5 charges) = -15 on block (says this but I suspect that the frame data is wrong)

With all these moves except they are safe EXCEPT 1,1,2 string. You can do a quick reversal to punish it.

Even though these strings are safe with the exception of 1,1,2 you have a lot of frames to your advantage. Chances are you are doing something that will get beat out by Raiden's 6 frame f1 move.

What most people don't even realise that after that string you can simply stop Raiden from doing it again if you just d 1, d3 or d4 (this is all character specific depending on what their best crouching poke is).

You have options against it on block. Just need to know what they are. And once you get a low poke you have advantage frames on block to start harassing Raiden.

I hope this helps people struggling against it.

Low Blow said:

once you get a low poke you have advantage frames on block to start harassing Raiden.

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Which character has advantage on block?

I haven't found a poke in this game that is higher than 0 on block.

Kano's EX knife throw is +9 but that's a special.

infamy23 said:

Which character has advantage on block?

I haven't found a poke in this game that is higher than 0 on block.

Kano's EX knife throw is +9 but that's a special.

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Well see it like this . If i do a string that leaves me at -6 on block. My opponent has 6 frames where I can't do anything.
So with this knowledge if you use a d4 with Kano which has 7 frame start up. I only have one frame to work with which will be block most of the time.

If I try to do anything that has longer start up on -6 frames I will get hit straight away and won't even come out.

People need to take advantage of how many frames your opponent is on block if they use a combo string

Low Blow said:

Well see it like this . If i do a string that leaves me at -6 on block. My opponent has 6 frames where I can't do anything.
So with this knowledge if you use a d4 with Kano which has 7 frame start up. I only have one frame to work with which will be block most of the time.

If I try to do anything that has longer start up on -6 frames I will get hit straight away and won't even come out.

People need to take advantage of how many frames your opponent is on block if they use a combo string

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What's to stop me from blocking your poke then doing f12b2 again. You are losing the exchange because I am chipping you out, as well as building a ton of meter. If you poke don't do it everything because you well be read and countered. Did you know if kano uses d4 after my f12b2 I can walk backwards and whiff punish with b2 or b3, and I'm sure those aren't my only whiff punish options. Raiden probably has the best counterpoking game so telling people to poke might be not be the best advice.

Low Blow said:

There are a few things you can against lightning when you block it. Here are the following frames on block when you block the full lightning strings:

f1,2,b2 (hold for 4 charges) = -8 on block
b3,2 (Hold for 4 charges) = -6 on block (might be wrong on the frames of this as well)
1,1,2 (Hold for 4 charges) = -14 on block (might be wrong as well but I know this string is punishable)
f2, 2+4 (Hold for 5 charges) = -15 on block (says this but I suspect that the frame data is wrong)

With all these moves except they are safe EXCEPT 1,1,2 string. You can do a quick reversal to punish it.

Even though these strings are safe with the exception of 1,1,2 you have a lot of frames to your advantage. Chances are you are doing something that will get beat out by Raiden's 6 frame f1 move.

What most people don't even realise that after that string you can simply stop Raiden from doing it again if you just d 1, d3 or d4 (this is all character specific depending on what their best crouching poke is).

You have options against it on block. Just need to know what they are. And once you get a low poke you have advantage frames on block to start harassing Raiden.

I hope this helps people struggling against it.

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I believe this is the actual frame data on fully held TG strings:

F12b2: -7
B32: -7
f22+4: -2
32+4: -2
112: -10
B112: -10

Keep in mind, lots of pushback on all strings.