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The true reason stage interaction shouldn't be allowed in tournaments

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Scoot Magee

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
My thing is that nrs games are different. If there in I'll del with them and if not I wont.

What I want to know is was the game balanced around these interact ables and is it going to affect the game in a negative way?
 
chores

chores

bad at things
interactables wouldnt fly in any other game. if its not even its not even, how big of an advantage/disadvantage is not relevant. if anything the levels should have symmetrical interactables so both sides are the same. like in your examples if the keepaway characters starts on the corner with the 'get of jail' interactable that is significant
 
John Grizzly

John Grizzly

The axe that clears the forest
Knoterror said:
Honestly, I don't see why people can't understand the point of discussion here. It makes perfect sense to me. Let's just use MK9 Sub-Zero as an example.

He wants to corner trap you, right? That's the entirety of his game plan. That's not hyperbole either. That's ALL he's trying to do. To push you in that corner, set up a clone and lock down your options. Well, what if we end up with a stage where there's a corner escape interactible on the right side but not the left and Sub starts out on the left side? Right from the start of Round 1, I now have to focus my strategy on switching sides just to be able to have the CHANCE to corner trap you, which is needless to say much more risky than if I didn't have to worry about it.

I understand it improves the meta, and to be frank, I actually like it. I'm not even in favor of disabling interactibles. But to say that interactibles won't have some advantages to player side is being ignorant.
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I haven't read through this whole thread, but god damn did this open my eyes. You're totally right. Some character's entire gameplan will be getting you into that corner for pressure. If you just have a get out of jail free card, what's the point? And why should being on 1P or 2P side matter at all? Something random that is determined prior to the match even starting shouldn't benefit one or the other player. I don't know, man. I think I'm on the side of banning interactables for tourney play.

When I'm watching a stream I want to see the best player win on an equal play field. I don't want to see Tom Brady struggle the entire match just to try to switch positions with his opponent just so he can get them on the corner that doesn't have the acrobatic escape interactable.
 
CrimsonShadow

CrimsonShadow

Administrator and Community Engineer
Administrator
John Grizzly said:
If you just have a get out of jail free card
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My question is, how do people assume they know what's 'free' yet? I haven't seen a final determination of what's actually punishable and what's totally safe.

At the very least, the meter and stamina cost might be similar to a breaker. So if your jump is punishable, you might lose some meter, lose all your stamina, and then eat a combo punish and be unable to break.
 
Scoot Magee

Scoot Magee

But I didn't want to dash
Also mk9 stage sizes did play a huge roll in character advantages And there was no set stage standard from what I remember.
 
John Grizzly

John Grizzly

The axe that clears the forest
haketh said:
It's not random
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Ok, so are we having the players switch positions after every match and use the same stage every time? Otherwise, yes....that shit is random. Although I have no idea how the stage selection will work in this game tourney-wise. I'd hate to see them do what Street Fighter and Marvel do and just use the training stage for EVERYTHING. I get real sick of looking at it.

If there's an option to turn them off, I say it's at least considered for one big tourney. It could really open the community up and get some new faces involved.
 
Shark Tank

Shark Tank

I don't actually play these games
AH so now people are scared about dem corner escapes. Called it.

Shark Tank said:
I was considering making a thread about this a while ago but said fuck it I shouldn't, but since you did...

I would have no problem with this if you can make a read on it...however

Doombawkz (if I'm wrong about details feel free to blow me up) , when asked about it when he played, stated that the move had armor all the way through when landing and the landing was extremely quick to recover. That doesn't sit well with me. I'm a firm believer in the real estate battle for fighting games and giving a move armor like that and making it safe i feel is an extremely brain dead way of pretty much getting out of a real estate war that you lost. Kinda like Ryu/Ken tatsu out of the corner that had to get nerfed but better in some ways. But I'm also concerned about big body characters who(should hopefully) work to put you in the corner, then you mb out and they now have to go through a maze of crap to get you again in a really frustrating goose chase. If meter comes easy in this game I can easily foresee it becoming a matchup issue.

I didn't make a thread because it was a pretty early build so I'm not concerning myself with pax builds and shit. But hypothetically, if it did make it into the game in that form,, which I don't think it will, I'd be concerned.

EDIT, and if costs stamina meter, I'm less concerned.
Click to expand...


That is literally my main concern about intractables. Everything else seems gimmicky. The fact that it is for only one corner is alarming.
 
John Grizzly

John Grizzly

The axe that clears the forest
CrimsonShadow said:
My question is, how do people assume they know what's 'free' yet? I haven't seen a final determination of what's actually punishable and what's totally safe.
Click to expand...
Very true. All speculation at this point. I'm simply going with what I've seen on stream. The corner vault doesn't look all that punishable.

I'm just staying in this thread because there's no spoilers here. Don't mind me.
 
Kitana Prime

Kitana Prime

Top-tier at everything but the characters I choose
John Grizzly said:
I haven't read through this whole thread, but god damn did this open my eyes. You're totally right. Some character's entire gameplan will be getting you into that corner for pressure. If you just have a get out of jail free card, what's the point? And why should being on 1P or 2P side matter at all? Something random shouldn't benefit one or the other player. I don't know, man. I think I'm on the side of banning interactables for tourney play.

When I'm watching a stream I want to see the best player win on an equal play field. I don't want to see Tom Brady struggle the entire match just to try to switch positions with his opponent just so he can get them on the corner that doesn't have the acrobatic escape interactable.
Click to expand...
[In response to this situation only, Ive laied out my argument in my first post]

If you think interactables automatically put him at a unique disadvantage, and you still willingly choose him, you don't get to complain.
So should we switch a rule just because it benefits Subzero's entire (emphasis on 'entire') gameplan? Thats purely situational. I'll need more examples than that - which we won't know until the game is out.
 
TotteryManx

TotteryManx

cr. HP Master
@Knoterror easily has the best argument against interactables(even if he doesn't mind them). A big part of 2d fighting games is putting your opponent in the corner. Them having the option to just EX a interactable to get out is kind of cheesy. It goes against the traditional 2d fighting games, but eventually this genre has to grow. It cannot remain the same forever without becoming bland and that is my argument FOR interactables. I also feel it can add more depth. Imagine punishing someone trying to jump out of a corner with Kano's up ball or something. Or cancelling a run into a armored move to stuff their attempt. Ultimately this game is going to be tons of fun imo.
 
CD jr

CD jr

Noob
so now we gave to worried about MUS, variations mus and counter picks, stage sizes and stage counter picks, AND now interactables lmfao stop this aint rockets science why can people just get it? its not about the damage, if they are unblockable, how much they change the match or how little, yet people keep mentioning those factors IRRELEVANT to the POINT being that in any way shape or form they DO affect the match THAT is the point
 
LionHeart V1

LionHeart V1

You will feel deaths cold embrace
Knoterror said:
Honestly, I don't see why people can't understand the point of discussion here. It makes perfect sense to me. Let's just use MK9 Sub-Zero as an example.

He wants to corner trap you, right? That's the entirety of his game plan. That's not hyperbole either. That's ALL he's trying to do. To push you in that corner, set up a clone and lock down your options. Well, what if we end up with a stage where there's a corner escape interactible on the right side but not the left and Sub starts out on the left side? Right from the start of Round 1, I now have to focus my strategy on switching sides just to be able to have the CHANCE to corner trap you, which is needless to say much more risky than if I didn't have to worry about it.

I understand it improves the meta, and to be frank, I actually like it. I'm not even in favor of disabling interactibles. But to say that interactibles won't have some advantages to player side is being ignorant.
Click to expand...
You deserve a cookie my lin kuei brother . I'm not in favor of anything that gives sub a disadvantage. Armor already destroyed him in MK9.
 
M2Dave

M2Dave

Zoning Master
CD jr said:
w.e mr dave. You and others are some of the people i wont have constructive arguments regarding MKX cause ya bring the worst out of me and i want to stay sane for MKX and just focus on making the better and helping the scene. we can however talk in private because i actually like as a person but you and others i am going to avoid publicly during MKX. im not giving you guys tje opportunity to make me look like shit every time i passively give my opinion on something when im just trying to help good day to you sir and may god help your soul if you even face me in tourney in MKX. From this point on you are muted hit me on facebook though pumpkin we can talk there all day
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Fool, I made you look "like shit" by consistently stating that you had one of the most dominating runs in Mortal Kombat 9 history, with a mid tier character. You are paranoid because your Twitter rants tend to get you in big trouble. It has absolutely nothing to do with me or anybody else. We must have talked about Injustice a total of one time, which was in Las Vegas last year.

To get back on topic, here is my point. You can run in Mortal Kombat X. Every second character seems to have a teleport. Some characters have anti-zoning variations. I am certain Smoke 2.0 and Martian Manhunter 2.0 are probably lurking somewhere in the game. So please do not come in this thread and cry about a zoning character escaping corners with the use of interactable objects.
 
Kitana Prime

Kitana Prime

Top-tier at everything but the characters I choose
The only time anything is banned in FGs is when it's random or super broke OP, which interactables are not in MKX.
Unless someone can tell/show me an instance in a FG where this isnt true, I'm sticking with it.
 
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