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Off-Topic Discussion for the day: Should jobs that provide full Health benefits have requirements?

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
Title:
An Analysis of Corporate Wellness Programs as it Relates to Small Business and the Affordable Health Care Act

Conclusion of my research on small business corporate wellness:
Based on the information provided, the size and growth of this small business, "CENSORED", and due to the expenses related with starting and maintaining a corporate wellness program, it is not cost effective to employ a corporate wellness program until 2016 at the earliest. It is more likely that in 2017 "CENSORED" will have enough working capital to be able to employ these strategies and receive the insurance discounts necessary to make this a cost effective business decision that will reinforce a culture of wellness within the organization. In this situation and for other small business with a growth rate similar to this, it will only be economical to employ a corporate wellness program of this type when the size of the business reaches the 100 FTE mark and when annual compensation is less than 25% of total annual insurance cost.

In this conclusion, compensation means the dollar amount reflecting the cost of implementing a corporate wellness program.
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Well coming from an actual Type-1 Diabetic who was not born with the disease. I feel that a full time job should provide Medical benefits, otherwise my entire paycheck alone would go into supporting my condition. Currently my disease costs me loads of money and often times can barely make the payment to support the condition. I will elaborate more on this later on Pig.
Thanks for posting
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
People should take advantage of the benefits and they should attempt to live a healthier lifestyle. But they shouldn't be required to.
Again I like the idea of better companies getting major tax breaks for all employees and the company itself by implementing this
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
So no one has suggested that everyone work together?

I think company's should def. make health care a privilege. However, why aren't business' working with Gym's, Yoga, Running groups etc etc? How hard would it be for ANY company to call up a local gym and say "We are going to 'prefer' you as our companies gym. What we need from you is to tag these people [employee health care list of people who signed up THROUGH work] and let us know their habits of working out."

Now you have accountability as well as helping out local business' to grow.

This can also be done in other ways. I'm pretty sure Canada does blood tests.

The problem is "America is free bitches".

This means people feel they can just do whatever they want.

what a mess our healthcare system has become :(
That's actually what I was thinking in terms of all working together in a "best scenario" situation
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
Once a company reaches 100 FTEs it becomes smart to offer wellness programs due to the tax benefits associated with that. It also reduces insurance cost for everyone.

The business has no control over what kind of care they are entitled to because they are not the same thing as the insurance company.
 

Art

Grave_Intent
@AK Pig
As a person who "developed" type 2 diabetes, all I can say from a personal is... That I currently do NOT have health insurance and it's slowly killing me not being able to see a doctor to help manage this damn condition. I have developed Sever Diabetic Nero-pithy in my feet making wearing shoes and even walking painful. I didn't ask to be a diabetic nor did I want to be one it just happened.

As mentioned before, I think the FDA has a responsibility to the American people to restrict the use of pure sugars used to make food taste better and boost sales. People who develop this condition have no idea that the food they love so much causes it, and even if they do know people have become so apathetic towards sugar they seem to think it will never happen to them until it's to late. To add a "Requirement" to be met to be able to gain or maintain health insurance is insane! What about people like myself? I am NOT morbidly obese I look like a normal person, but the affliction still screws me. So if I ever am able to afford health care how can I go to a gym and work out with the pain to be able to get health care to get prescriptions to manage my pain and condition?

Implementing the requirement idea would bring thousands of people to the disability office costing even more on government healthcare. Sorry PIG but it just wont work...
 

AK L0rdoftheFLY

I hatelove this game
@AK Pig
As a person who "developed" type 2 diabetes, all I can say from a personal is... That I currently do NOT have health insurance and it's slowly killing me not being able to see a doctor to help manage this damn condition. I have developed Sever Diabetic Nero-pithy in my feet making wearing shoes and even walking painful. I didn't ask to be a diabetic nor did I want to be one it just happened.

As mentioned before, I think the FDA has a responsibility to the American people to restrict the use of pure sugars used to make food taste better and boost sales. People who develop this condition have no idea that the food they love so much causes it, and even if they do know people have become so apathetic towards sugar they seem to think it will never happen to them until it's to late. To add a "Requirement" to be met to be able to gain or maintain health insurance is insane! What about people like myself? I am NOT morbidly obese I look like a normal person, but the affliction still screws me. So if I ever am able to afford health care how can I go to a gym and work out with the pain to be able to get health care to get prescriptions to manage my pain and condition?

Implementing the requirement idea would bring thousands of people to the disability office costing even more on government healthcare. Sorry PIG but it just wont work...
you can afford healthcare now...its just not as good as it was pre reform
 

VenomX-90

"On your Knees!"
I say its stupid how they fine your ass if you dont have Obama care or something like that, at least thats what I heard they do...
 

aj1701

Noob
You're not taking into account that what people do in personal lives does not directly affect the company. If they choose to provide health insurance it would not only be hypocritical but also just completely fucked if they denied a few people insurance because they're unhealthy. The company doesn't care about whether or not a person is healthy as long as they're coming in and getting the job done, that's the insurance company's problem.
Smart employer would be concerned about your health; poor health translates to poor productivity, go google for studies supporting that. It also does affect what the company has to pay for the premiums. I worked at a startup and the HR person said that our health insurance costs were lower because the company consisted of mostly young healthy people.

I'm not offended at all, but this entire concept is a little ridiculous. People can go out and get insurance on their own but they know they can't get good coverage if they're unhealthy so they take whatever the company they work for is offering. At the end of the day, you have good intentions. I see that you want people to lead a healthy lifestyle and I respect that. Cutting off someone's health benefits due to them being unhealthy is not the answer though.
Would you have an issue with unhealthy people being charged a higher premium for their coverage? After all, being unhealthy does cost more even if you're in an accident that has nothing to do with your health. There is more risk to any surgery if you're diabetic, just as one example.
 

aj1701

Noob
The incentive to lead a healthier lifestyle is already there once you acquire health insurance because they let you know from the jump that leading a healthier lifestyle would allow them to provide you lower premiums.
Actually I believe part of Obamacare is that insurance companies CANT do that.
 
You cant force people, however encouraging exercise and eat healthy would be more beneficial. Government needs to put limits drugs. The gov also requires doctors, ads, and media to encourage people to exercise by making researches and ways to be healthy more applicable and accessible. There is also a need of encouraging healthy eating (this can be encouraged by lowering tax for restaurants that sell healthy food and support gym memberships, force restaurants to put calories/bad fat/ healthy fat/ sodium/ sugar content.

Eating healthy and exercise would alleviate most of the health problems in america
 
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NRF CharlieMurphy

Kindergarten Meta
That's actually what I was thinking in terms of all working together in a "best scenario" situation
I'm actually curious how you'd go about it as well.
Like the premise of your idea has merit and value.

Basically we are thinking up ways to "trick" people into not being a slob, while making them think it is actually their own idea.

I also probably share an even more radical idea about prison. My ideas are def. not humane..... but then again..... neither is rape/murder.

I personally think simply having a reform on pricing of food, and what can be served period, would make a hell of a difference here. All the people working and flipping burgers would be just as effective at helping grow crops, feed animals, etc etc.
 

aj1701

Noob
Poor people don't eat as well because they can't afford to.
Not true. It's cheaper to cook at home than eat out.

Poor people don't work out because they can't afford to.
Walking / running was free last time I checked, as are push-ups and other body weight exercises. This is a moot point anyway as its not possible to exercise your way out of a bad diet (unless your someone like Michael Phelps).

When they need care it is provided whether they have insurance or not. And the care is paid for whether they have insurance or not.
Having health insurance doesn't make health care free either, its just a different way to pay for it that spreads the risk over a larger population and uses investments to help generate extra money for the pool.

You say they shouldn't get health care; does that extend to all care? Are you saying let irresponsible people die? Just deny them care? You know they give prison inmates all the care they need right? So a rapist should get all the care they need but not a poor person?
Maybe we should; this is America where you are free to live your life however you choose. Maybe its time we let people realize the consequences of their own actions (or inactions).

As for full time workers, taxpayers don't pay their healthcare, so how would their unhealthy lifestyles affect taxpayers?
Our taxes directly pay for Medicaid / Medicare. Also, the same insurance companies that provide my benefits are also selling benefits on the exchanges. The companies look at the risks in an area, so someone down the road that happens to by from the same carrier I have directly impacts my premiums.

By your logic, why give poor people anything? Lebron james' mother, a pregnant, out of wedlock teen should have been given no taxpayer aid in your opinion, because she was irresponsible? Now, Lebrun is paying more taxes than anyone on this forum probably ever will, but I guess he should have just been put in foster care, no?

Denying poor people/irresponsible people any kind of care is cruel, and actually financially inefficient, because no one is going to let them starve to death and ban them from health care. By your logic, why not let irresponsible criminals all starve to death and deny them health care while incarcerated, no matter what the crime is. Irresponsible is irresponsible, no?
There have actually been a number of studies that show giving entitlements like we are encourages people to just keep taking them by making them dependent on the entitlements instead of trying to figure out how to do it for themselves. You make people dependent on the system instead of getting them back to a place to be independent again. Check out this: http://www.thenewamerican.com/reviews/opinion/item/12711-federal-entitlements-living-large-in-poverty

Quite frankly it really annoys me when I see someone paying for their groceries with WIC / Food stamps whilst talking on their iPhone 5.
 

aj1701

Noob
The idea would work better by offering positive reinforcement to those who are actively staying healthy as opposed to penalizing those who have unhealthy routines.

Think safe-driving-bonus-check or w/e
Not sure where you're going with the safe driving bonus; your rates also typically go up if you have an accident, maybe two if your insurance coverage includes accident forgiveness (which is usually one accident in the span of three years).
 
I like this but what if they actively destroy it w their eating as well?
I used to live in the Bronx, and my area was actually classified as a "food desert", meaning there are many pockets of places where there's no place to get proper fresh produce in a reasonably driveable distance. Not my area specifically, as I lived in the Bronx's "Little Italy", but other areas in the Bronx have maybe one or none at all to get good food at.

There are alot of similar areas around the country too. Mostly in poor communities where the residents don't have enough money to buy anything more than cheap microwave food, so proper grocery stores don't get enough business to stay open there.

That's why I distinguish it from smoking, it's not always a choice.
 

Zyphox

What is going on guys, Ya Boi Zyphox here.
I'm saying irresponsible people don't

I was brainstorming briefly w some people I work with yesterday because they mentioned how many people on staff have severe health problems since working there due to not taking care of themselves in any way (terrible eating, smoking, etc etc ) but have benefits from the company where as some part time employees there working 2-3 jobs find time to take care of themselves but need benefits for their families so the conversation arose

After thinking about I do feel you should earn benefits by what you do professionally but earn the right to keep those benefits (health, dental, etc) by doing your part as well

The trick thing is discussing what and how much

I'm sorry for any offended for this that I like good health, promote it, believe in it and want to see myself and others healthy and living
i sell health insurance for a living, the problem with this is that group health insurance provided by Employers don't require underwriting (atleast not most) to give out the insurance. the primary insurance holder is your employer, everyone else just receives a certificate of insurance. with this system everyone pays into the overall pool for the insurance and you could be 21, healthier than an Ox, or 64 with every sickness and disease in the books. the fact that no underwriting takes place causes the dilemma. a good suggestion would be to consider underwriting for everyone and then the employee pays a portion every month based on their current health with an annual check up each year, mandatory. If you are an employee and want to pay less than what you are doing so far then get into a gym, exercise, eat healthy, quit smoking etc. the only problem with this is we are so used to this system that not everyone will think it is fair. and it discriminates too much to begin with. for example hispanic and african americans have shown to have more health problems in terms of diabetes and such (which is why we have less life expectancy) than other races because of the overall culture of the groups. would it be fair because of how you eat at home, even though you work out, to have to pay more premium than others? not to mention that people have inherited diseases and such. IMO it should stay as it is in terms of employer benefits, too many variables. i see too many things everyday at work, i hear sad stories everyday for people looking to sign up for Medicare supplement plans and they were denied for health reasons (and it takes a lot to be denied from us i'll tell you that, #realtalk).
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
You cant force people, however encouraging exercise and eat healthy would be more beneficial. Government needs to put limits drugs. The gov also requires doctors, ads, and media to encourage people to exercise by making researches and ways to be healthy more applicable and accessible. There is also a need of encouraging healthy eating (this can be encouraged by lowering tax for restaurants that sell healthy food and support gym memberships, force restaurants to put calories/bad fat/ healthy fat/ sodium/ sugar content.

Eating healthy and exercise would eleaviate most of the health problems in america
I like the idea of lowering taxes for restaurants (tax break) for offering a % of healthy items off their menu
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
Not true. It's cheaper to cook at home than eat out.



Walking / running was free last time I checked, as are push-ups and other body weight exercises. This is a moot point anyway as its not possible to exercise your way out of a bad diet (unless your someone like Michael Phelps).



Having health insurance doesn't make health care free either, its just a different way to pay for it that spreads the risk over a larger population and uses investments to help generate extra money for the pool.



Maybe we should; this is America where you are free to live your life however you choose. Maybe its time we let people realize the consequences of their own actions (or inactions).



Our taxes directly pay for Medicaid / Medicare. Also, the same insurance companies that provide my benefits are also selling benefits on the exchanges. The companies look at the risks in an area, so someone down the road that happens to by from the same carrier I have directly impacts my premiums.



There have actually been a number of studies that show giving entitlements like we are encourages people to just keep taking them by making them dependent on the entitlements instead of trying to figure out how to do it for themselves. You make people dependent on the system instead of getting them back to a place to be independent again. Check out this: http://www.thenewamerican.com/reviews/opinion/item/12711-federal-entitlements-living-large-in-poverty

Quite frankly it really annoys me when I see someone paying for their groceries with WIC / Food stamps whilst talking on their iPhone 5.
<3
 

Pig Of The Hut

Day 0 Phenomenal Dr. Fate and Darkseid player
I used to live in the Bronx, and my area was actually classified as a "food desert", meaning there are many pockets of places where there's no place to get proper fresh produce in a reasonably driveable distance. Not my area specifically, as I lived in the Bronx's "Little Italy", but other areas in the Bronx have maybe one or none at all to get good food at.

There are alot of similar areas around the country too. Mostly in poor communities where the residents don't have enough money to buy anything more than cheap microwave food, so proper grocery stores don't get enough business to stay open there.

That's why I distinguish it from smoking, it's not always a choice.
How close would a grocery store be?