Match-up Discussion Lex Luthor Matchup Discussion (Version 1.06)

rev0lver said:

miloPKL i can get the reasoning for some of that but i have no idea how that makes sense for bane, cyborg, shazam, and superman

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I actually kind of agree with his reasoning on all 4.

Bane's level 3 armor breaking properties, his ability to armor straight through 50/50s and his good wakeups make this MU kind of suck. Now granted level 3 venom doesn't last long, but pretty much every time it comes up it breaks all of our momentum and forces us to start blocking mixups until it ends.
Admittedly, I don't have a huge amount of Bane experience, but I really don't see how this MU could be in Lex's favor.




Cyborg is weird... If you know how to backdash his projectile it allows you to put up shields while getting zoned then forces him to MB his projectile to keep you out. If he does, w/e, you took like 8% or something and he lost a bar. Just do it again until he has no meter left to keep you out.
You can also jump the projectile if he does a low to the ground one, then air CC. Assuming you're not fullscreen, you can actually punish him for doing a low to the ground blast.
Once you're in, mixups for days. His wakeup's not TERRIBLE, but it's not good either. Just keep doing wakeup traps against him, and even if he does get up, he's still not in a good position and probably going to try to grapple away.
To be perfectly honest, I actually think this MU is 6-4 in our favor.





Shazam is definitely in our favor though. Probes and mines allow Lex to be one of the few characters who can successfully control space against Shazam. With them, you can shut out his teleport options, and when you throw a lance blast in, you also shut down the Atlas Torpedo. On top of that, Armor really hurts Shazam since he has no multihit moves, and if we have armor up we can just shit all over command throw mixups.
Oh and a few random facts about this MU: (I have played it WAAAAAAY too many times):

-When you block a torpedo, 112>MB Vaccuum works.
-When you have a mine and probe out full screen, one of Shazam's only ways out of this situation and back into close range is Atlas torpedo. Lance blast does stop this, but at that range so will a random vaccuum. If you whiff, it doesn't matter because the probe will cover you, but if he did try to torpedo, that's full combo. If he stops trying to torpedo as a result, then laser/missiles put him in a "damned no matter what you do" situation where running into a mine becomes his BEST option as long as we don't read it (If we do, then we can CC in close then full combo).
-Do NOT be afraid to pushblock him if you don't have armor. Them command grab mixups are scary.
-If you D1 in between his 22 string, the second hit sends you flying outside of grab range, nullifying the mixup completely (I don't know why this works. It makes no sense that it does.).






Superman I also think is dead even. Yes, I know his trait nullifies ours, and that's annoying, but it also forces him to use trait any time we set up armor, which means no trait cancel shenanigans, making his pressure a lot less scary. Especially since if you use level 1-2 armor to bait him into using trait, ours recharges faster than his.
You can backdash lasers, especially straight lasers, fairly easily, to put up armor as well.

That said, as much as I've talked about armor in this MU, It's not something I use too much. With his trait reset out of the way, Supes' only real mixup becomes the string that ends with overhead or scoops. Scoops gets full combo punished if you guess right. The overhead puts us back at neutral. Pushblock if you need to get away from Superman's bullying/pressure.
Probes, as usual, are godlike, and mixed with mines they allow you to curb Superman's mobility as well. By limiting his options like this, you can zone him at full screen, or force him to airdash his way through it. J3 will shut that option down and give you a full combo, and if you read wrong, who cares? Probes and mines keep you safe.
That said, much like Shazam's torpedo, Superman's charging punch thing will get him through it, but he just wasted meter (and possibly trait since otherwise you can full combo punish it with armor up) to get to neutral, assuming you didn't do a J3 and make it whiff completely.

Really the only things I see that give Supes any kind of advantage in this MU are his trait, his super, his pressure strings/whiff punishers, mobility and wakeups being good. Unfortunately for him, we have the tools to deal with all of those (except the super) and constantly limit his options.

Fromundaman said:

I actually kind of agree with his reasoning on all 4.

Bane's level 3 armor breaking properties, his ability to armor straight through 50/50s and his good wakeups make this MU kind of suck. Now granted level 3 venom doesn't last long, but pretty much every time it comes up it breaks all of our momentum and forces us to start blocking mixups until it ends.
Admittedly, I don't have a huge amount of Bane experience, but I really don't see how this MU could be in Lex's favor.

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When Bane doesn't have lvl 3 venom Lex can do what he wants pretty much. I talked about it a little bit in the Bane section, but I don't see how it's even/Bane adv unless he can really do a lot when lvl 3 is up. And even when he does get it, Lex is practically guaranteed to get something on his cooldown. With Bane's lvl 3 charge too, Lex has ways of dealing with it with mines+normals/vacuum or whatever. At worst it's like 0.5 in Lex's favor

Cyborg is weird... If you know how to backdash his projectile it allows you to put up shields while getting zoned then forces him to MB his projectile to keep you out. If he does, w/e, you took like 8% or something and he lost a bar. Just do it again until he has no meter left to keep you out.
You can also jump the projectile if he does a low to the ground one, then air CC. Assuming you're not fullscreen, you can actually punish him for doing a low to the ground blast.
Once you're in, mixups for days. His wakeup's not TERRIBLE, but it's not good either. Just keep doing wakeup traps against him, and even if he does get up, he's still not in a good position and probably going to try to grapple away.
To be perfectly honest, I actually think this MU is 6-4 in our favor.

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The thing is, even if you do trait backdash a fireball you're now at fullscreen. And you only get one free hit on his fireball to help you get in, which isn't much really. And with his mb fireball, it doesn't even matter for him that much with how fast Cyborg builds meter. Unless you do it super early on a read, an air corp charge to get in like that can get you punished or at least put you negative. His grapple is pretty good in it too. I don't think it's that bad but Lex's mobility puts this in Cyborg's favor. But like a lot of things too, I wouldn't think it if I hadn't trained it with people like Relaxed and Jailhouse.

Shazam is definitely in our favor though. Probes and mines allow Lex to be one of the few characters who can successfully control space against Shazam. With them, you can shut out his teleport options, and when you throw a lance blast in, you also shut down the Atlas Torpedo. On top of that, Armor really hurts Shazam since he has no multihit moves, and if we have armor up we can just shit all over command throw mixups.

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I see this MU as 5-5 at best. I ran it a lot with REO when he was playing him and he really figured out how to exploit what Shazam can do in it. Mines don't shut him down at all, he can teleport into them for free and get invincibility on them. Same with probes, he can teleport through. I have it as negative mostly because of Shazam's ability to not give a fuck about most Lex setups in open space and off knockdowns. With armor too, Shazam doesn't have anything multihitting but he has ways to fuck with it, like mixing up things into torpedo. And as far as torpedos go normally, I know Lex can usually punish it, but they shouldn't be throwing them out randomly anyway when they don't need to

Superman I also think is dead even. Yes, I know his trait nullifies ours, and that's annoying, but it also forces him to use trait any time we set up armor, which means no trait cancel shenanigans, making his pressure a lot less scary. Especially since if you use level 1-2 armor to bait him into using trait, ours recharges faster than his.
You can backdash lasers, especially straight lasers, fairly easily, to put up armor as well.

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The trait thing's not just annoying though, it shuts down a major part of Lex's game. Superman's pressure and zoning is better in the matchup. It's not about mixing up with overhead or scoop (which idk why people don't block anyway), it's the general pressure and Lex's risks he needs to take to get out of it aren't that good. Especially when you get pushed to the corner.

It's hard to get things out without getting hit by his zoning too in open space. And with the mb dash punch thing, it's not really that bad for Superman either with his ability to build meter. But he generally doesn't need to do it either.

rev0lver said:

When Bane doesn't have lvl 3 venom Lex can do what he wants pretty much. I talked about it a little bit in the Bane section, but I don't see how it's even/Bane adv unless he can really do a lot when lvl 3 is up. And even when he does get it, Lex is practically guaranteed to get something on his cooldown. With Bane's lvl 3 charge too, Lex has ways of dealing with it with mines+normals/vacuum or whatever. At worst it's like 0.5 in Lex's favor

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I don't know this MU as much as I'd like, so maybe so. I felt the fact he could go level 3 on reaction if he sees us try something in armor hurt a lot though.

rev0lver said:

The thing is, even if you do trait backdash a fireball you're now at fullscreen. And you only get one free hit on his fireball to help you get in, which isn't much really. And with his mb fireball, it doesn't even matter for him that much with how fast Cyborg builds meter. Unless you do it super early on a read, an air corp charge to get in like that can get you punished or at least put you negative. His grapple is pretty good in it too. I don't think it's that bad but Lex's mobility puts this in Cyborg's favor. But like a lot of things too, I wouldn't think it if I hadn't trained it with people like Relaxed and Jailhouse.

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I meant trait backdash it full screen then immediately CC to close the distance. You armor through one fireball if he did fireball, get punished for 8% or something like that if he MBs it, or go back to neutral if he does anything else, possibly punish if he tried to hit you through armor.

And yeah, air CC is definitely meant to be on a read.

We have a good MMH/Cyborg player locally, and it has always felt like once I learned how to get through his rather unique zoning, Cyborg has a lot of trouble.

rev0lver said:

I see this MU as 5-5 at best. I ran it a lot with REO when he was playing him and he really figured out how to exploit what Shazam can do in it. Mines don't shut him down at all, he can teleport into them for free and get invincibility on them. Same with probes, he can teleport through. I have it as negative mostly because of Shazam's ability to not give a fuck about most Lex setups in open space and off knockdowns. With armor too, Shazam doesn't have anything multihitting but he has ways to fuck with it, like mixing up things into torpedo. And as far as torpedos go normally, I know Lex can usually punish it, but they shouldn't be throwing them out randomly anyway when they don't need to

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I meant any time you happen to block a torpedo you can punish it on reaction. I honestly don't know why people don't do this more (Maybe a general lack of matchup experience against Shazam?), but both torpedo and the elbow drop (If it's not canceled into something) should be full combo punished every time since you have more than enough time to react to the fact you blocked it and punish.

Also you're right, on wakeup Shazam doesn't care about mines. However, the rest of the time if he teleports onto a mine he has to immediately block low to not get hit (Which means ji 3 pretty much becomes an unblockable if you see him teleport towards a mine). Also you can very much set yourself up so that probes punish teleport options. Granted he can try to wait it out, but our stage control is ridiculous and makes attempts at approaching us a guessing game that is much more in our favor than his.

Now don't get me wrong, yes, Shazam can get through these traps. Yes, he can fuck with armor. The thing is, he has very limited options for doing so, and every time you force him to cancel into a torpedo to fuck with armor, you can punish it. In fact, you should look for it, since if he mixes you up and tries to grab you, you can react to it and full combo punish (With armor that is).
Now he's in a position where all of his offensive options can be punished, which leaves him only his teleport to make his strings safe. This just puts us back in neutral, except we still have armor.

rev0lver said:

The trait thing's not just annoying though, it shuts down a major part of Lex's game. Superman's pressure and zoning is better in the matchup. It's not about mixing up with overhead or scoop (which idk why people don't block anyway), it's the general pressure and Lex's risks he needs to take to get out of it aren't that good. Especially when you get pushed to the corner.

It's hard to get things out without getting hit by his zoning too in open space. And with the mb dash punch thing, it's not really that bad for Superman either with his ability to build meter. But he generally doesn't need to do it either.

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The trait makes us play this matchup differently from other matchups, I agree. However, our trait also forces superman to play us differently. Now admittedly, we're hurt more by it than he is, but it's still a 2 way street. He disregards armor at the cost of a mixup.

What risks? You can poke Superman out of his pressure strings with D1 if he tries to constantly hit buttons and bully you. If he blocks then woohoo, you hit him with D1 on block and go back to neutral. Yeah, his neutral game is better than ours, but it doesn't matter THAT much, and if worse comes to worse, you can pushblock him to make some space.
Oh, and you can grab him out of some of his pressure strings too.

I do agree though, don't go anywhere near the corner in this MU.


As for zoning, if you duck a straight laser, you can throw out MB probes. You will get hit if he does a second straight laser, but the MB probes keep him locked down long enough to get yourself started, and if you already had armor vs untraited Supes, you have just gotten a huge advantage in the zoning war.
If you block an air laser that isn't MBed, free MB probes.
If you read a straight laser, MB Hidden Missiles will trade with it for a trade that is in your favor and allows you to set up.
If you read a grounded laser of any kind, you can jump over it and punish with CC from just about any distance (Might not work point blank range, not sure but you have better punishes at that range). This same punish works for air laser (or just jump>air dash), but with a different timing.
If you duck a straight laser, you can also trade with the next projectile if you do a lance blast.

This is all on top of the fact that Superman has the EASIEST projectiles to backdash, so free armor is possible at almost any point when he zones you, and to beat it he has to use trait, which let's you get a free drone out.

Fromundaman said:

I don't know this MU as much as I'd like, so maybe so. I felt the fact he could go level 3 on reaction if he sees us try something in armor hurt a lot though.

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The problem is that there's a reason why Bane players work their way up to lvl 3, obviously. It's risky to keep going straight for it because Lex can kill him on cooldown, but a lot of times he kind of has to do it in the MU. But that's why it's in our favor, imo.

I meant trait backdash it full screen then immediately CC to close the distance. You armor through one fireball if he did fireball, get punished for 8% or something like that if he MBs it, or go back to neutral if he does anything else, possibly punish if he tried to hit you through armor.

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You close the distance that way but you're not really in and your trait's gone. And I don't know why meter burning the fireball is such a big deal for him with his meter building. Cyborg can spend meter pretty liberally since all he really needs it for midscreen is mb fireball.

I meant any time you happen to block a torpedo you can punish it on reaction. I honestly don't know why people don't do this more (Maybe a general lack of matchup experience against Shazam?), but both torpedo and the elbow drop (If it's not canceled into something) should be full combo punished every time since you have more than enough time to react to the fact you blocked it and punish.

Also you're right, on wakeup Shazam doesn't care about mines. However, the rest of the time if he teleports onto a mine he has to immediately block low to not get hit (Which means ji 3 pretty much becomes an unblockable if you see him teleport towards a mine). Also you can very much set yourself up so that probes punish teleport options. Granted he can try to wait it out, but our stage control is ridiculous and makes attempts at approaching us a guessing game that is much more in our favor than his.

Now don't get me wrong, yes, Shazam can get through these traps. Yes, he can fuck with armor. The thing is, he has very limited options for doing so, and every time you force him to cancel into a torpedo to fuck with armor, you can punish it. In fact, you should look for it, since if he mixes you up and tries to grab you, you can react to it and full combo punish (With armor that is).
Now he's in a position where all of his offensive options can be punished, which leaves him only his teleport to make his strings safe. This just puts us back in neutral, except we still have armor.

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I don't really have a problem punishing torpedo. I'm just saying idk why they would just be throwing it out.

For the mines, if I'm not mistaken, they get invincibility on the recovery and the mine just disappears. They don't have to worry about it at all. And with probes, they can teleport on reaction to the probe hits and not have to worry about it much either. It is more useful obviously though when you're using that up close. The thing with the torpedo mixups are that it gives him options that a lot of other characters don't have. That by itself doesn't make it a bad MU, but Shazam's ability to get out of Lex's setups better than almost anyone else doesn't give Lex any advantage.

The trait makes us play this matchup differently from other matchups, I agree. However, our trait also forces superman to play us differently. Now admittedly, we're hurt more by it than he is, but it's still a 2 way street. He disregards armor at the cost of a mixup.

What risks? You can poke Superman out of his pressure strings with D1 if he tries to constantly hit buttons and bully you. If he blocks then woohoo, you hit him with D1 on block and go back to neutral. Yeah, his neutral game is better than ours, but it doesn't matter THAT much, and if worse comes to worse, you can pushblock him to make some space.

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His whiff punishing is a big thing in it too, though, so that's why the risks are there. You can defend against Superman all day but it's not going to get you anywhere. His whole game is styled around opening you up and getting big damage. Compounded with his zoning and his trait is what makes this bad. Like, yes you can duck/block a laser, mb probe and trait up, but then he can just trait. And the air lasers are a big thing too. Superman's better almost all around in the MU. The only time Lex has an actual advantage is when you have trait and Superman's in a situation where he can't trait up. But against high level Supermans that's only going to happen so much in a match.

I think we are misunderstanding each other. I'm not saying these characters can't do anything, but I am saying we have tools to deal with their shenanigans.

For example, yes Cyborg gets meter like crazy, but what makes fighting Cyborg hard is trying to get in as he peppers you with blasts and missiles. We have a way to get through that almost for free.


Against Shazam, yes, he does in fact avoid our traps better than some characters, but it doesn't really matter much if they negate everything that makes the character scary.
Sure he can teleport on reaction to a probe, but that forces him to do something (teleport) which we can take advantage of. For example, lance blast forces him to block the moment he comes out of the teleport. Throwing out a slightly delayed MB Hidden missiles makes the missiles appear where he does. You can armor up for free while he does his teleport. I mean, you are forcing him to play your game just by having the probe out.
The best thing he can do is backdash it (Which my local shazam and training partner does a lot), but he still has to block a follow up lance blast and/or let me get free armor.

Similarly, Shazam CAN use torpedo mixups to get around armor, only here's the thing: It's no longer a mixup if I can punish EVERY other offensive option he has off of a blockstring on reaction. Armor shuts down the guessing game completely, and that is horrible for Shazam.

So yeah, Shazam does get through Lex's gameplan better than most, but Lex completely disrespects the greatest thing Shazam has going for him: Command grab mixups.

Also, the invincibility on recovery of teleport killing the mines only happens on wakeup. On non-wakeup teleports he has to crouch block the mine when he reappears.



As for Supes I agree with a lot of your points, except for one.

If you duck a laser and pull out MB probes, how is the zoning game not in our favor? Like at that point the traits don't even matter; they're just gravy. MB probes keeps him pinned down for a satellite laser or mine, which allow you to pull out another probe.
Now if you backdash a laser and trait up, yes, Supes is probably going to activate trait too. You know what he's not doing during the time he turns on trait? Shooting you (And if he had shot you instead, armor eats the hit). This means you can throw a MB probe back out, and now his trait doesn't matter anymore.
The only time I see Supes winning in zoning is if he has trait and you don't.
The fact that our zoning is essentially based around reacting to and shutting down his is a big deal IMO.

im on break on phone at work but quickly

supes lasers arent a big deal to navigate imo and lex normals are equal in range or greater than sups. supe has the trait killer thats an advantage. supes also faster. probes can keep supes from zapping. it might be 4 - 6 supes at worst imo. but 5-5 for now.

lex doesnt need to trap shazam just copr charge j3 and lance.

cyborg might be 4 - 6 cyborg too but he never gave me trouble yet. the fireball is annoying sure but thats basically all he has and its not as bad as gunshots imo.


bane just totally fucks lex tbh i would consider calling it 3 -7 bane... i play a bane practice buddy and he wrecks my shit. any tips? i think i cant poke out his pressure so i gotta let him bulldog me and read when he attempts a mixup or throw. bane trait will steal lexs on block too. bane damage is insane. bane everything. i hate bane!!!!

i know its easier said than done but with bane just make sure u avoid the corner at all costs. besides that be patient until hes in cooldown then set stuff up just make sure your in shield before he has venom up again after cool down because then youll punish anything he does

I played bipolar a good amount with lex and I really got the impression bane wins that. You can't wake up, keeping him out is almost impossible, lvl 3 venom doesnt give half a shit about lex trait, and I reeaallllyy could not catch him for the life of me when he was on debuff. :/

im starting to rethink the lex bane matchup. i made an adaption my bane main partner is yet to counter. i think last time i said 4-6 Bane... but maybe 5-5 or 4-6 lex

AK elitegoomba said:

I played bipolar a good amount with lex and I really got the impression bane wins that. You can't wake up, keeping him out is almost impossible, lvl 3 venom doesnt give half a shit about lex trait, and I reeaallllyy could not catch him for the life of me when he was on debuff. :/

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I played a good set with Bipolar a little bit ago and he agrees with me that Lex probably wins. You have to be super aggressive when he's on cooldown and very patient on lvl 3.

Also I know I lost to Grr at DTN but I beat him in a mm after so I'm counting that ha

what do you guys do against a batman whos spamming batarangs?

For those Lex players who were watching Winter Brawl, we witnessed a new terror. A threat to our beloved main character...

A despicable creature who may absolutely kill any hope of future top 8 Lex's so long as he is present....



*shudders*

imblackjames said:

what do you guys do against a batman whos spamming batarangs?

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lex actually trades in his favor vs batman. of course batman's is faster and he has trait with it so it's not as easy as that, but it's fine for us. otherwise just set up mb probes to get trait and go in patiently.

@LtLuthor i still think that mu is fine. i figured stuff out after. i also play 9000x worse than usual when i know i'm being streamed.

My current updated matchup chart:

Aquaman - 5-5, potential slight advantage
Ares - 5-5
Bane - 6-4
Batgirl - 5-5
Batman - 5-5
Black Adam - 6-4
Catwoman - 6-4
Cyborg - 4-6
Deathstroke - 4-6
Doomsday - 4-6
Flash - 4-6
Green Arrow- 6-4
Green Lantern - 4-6
Harley - 4-6
Hawkgirl- 6-4
Joker - 5-5
Killer Frost - 5-5
Lobo - 6-4, possibly better advantage
MMH - 5-5
Nightwing - 5-5
Raven - 4-6, POSSIBLY more even or even @GGA pimpimjim . but still no way it's lex adv
Scorpion - 5-5 ? (still the only one i'm missing good exp)
Shazam - 5-5
Sinestro - 2-8
Solomon Grundy - 6-4
Superman - 4-6
Wonder Woman - 6-4
Zatanna - 5-5, possible slight advantage
Zod - 4-6

Advantage : 8
Even : 11
Disadvantage : 10

Best matchups imo: Green Arrow, Wonder Woman, Hawkgirl
Worst matchups imo: Sinestro, Zod, Flash

Id think ravens match up was even. I can understand why its 6-4 in her favor to me it just tends to feel like more of a 5-5 than anything else (i don't have a ton of experience with a good raven)

id think nightwing would have an advantage to lex same with batgirl,

I agree with NW going even.

imblackjames said:

Id think ravens match up was even. I can understand why its 6-4 in her favor to me it just tends to feel like more of a 5-5 than anything else (i don't have a ton of experience with a good raven)

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The thing is, her trait when used the way it should be in the MU and when they use it as often as they should kills him. The up close game just feels slightly better if you're more patient.

Hmm, I agree with the MUs revolver posted above except for two. I think night wing and batgirl are at advantage vs lex, especially when night wing is in staff stance. Both have multi hitting wake ups that make trait less useful, night wing staff lightning and generally pressure annoy a slow charactr like lex. I've gotta guess 4-6 lex disadvantage for both. Sorry for nontechnical terms, I'm tired

Nw has ways to blow up armor but lex has ways to blow that up. For example if lex has trait on and I try to staff spin lex can block the first 3 hits, get hit by the last hit and get a full combo.

Severage said:

Hmm, I agree with the MUs revolver posted above except for two. I think night wing and batgirl are at advantage vs lex, especially when night wing is in staff stance. Both have multi hitting wake ups that make trait less useful, night wing staff lightning and generally pressure annoy a slow charactr like lex. I've gotta guess 4-6 lex disadvantage for both. Sorry for nontechnical terms, I'm tired

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I really don't think multihitting wakeups are a big deal unless it will stuff a trait backdash (like dd mb venom). You can blow up staff spin and cartwheel with trait up, which means you don't get free pressure on knockdowns but it makes one of their really good tools a big risk.

Read through this and I'm surprised there's no talk on Deathstroke. What does one do about his billion ways to break armor, also guns guns guns.

Jaku2011 said:

Read through this and I'm surprised there's no talk on Deathstroke. What does one do about his billion ways to break armor, also guns guns guns.

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Its all about dashing and blocking in between his gunshots then when you get close enough wait and block his attack then punish

LtLuthor said:

I think it should be a priority to find the best strategies against zoners. They are a huge barrier for people who want to main Lex, and probably the reason there are so few Lex players online- people just hate having no options at long range.

Specifically, Cyborg, Raven, and Sinestro.

Then other characters who aren't really zoners, but zone Lex out anyway. Such as Batgirl, where Lex can't do ANYTHING between her bola's (+3 ON BLOCK AND HITS MID WTF???) and batarangs, unless he wants to risk catching a free smoke-bomb.

I dunno if anyone watched the AK stream last week, but Clint's Lex was just completely stuffed by a Raven. Lex can hardly move against her. If she mixes up her soul-crush with her basic projectile, you can only safely get about 1/10th of a step between everything she shoots.....

Then there's Sinestro. If tournaments continue to not do forced-random stage picks, Sinestro players are going to try for Ferris Aircraft if they know what they're doing. That stage is a PROBLEM for Lex.

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I don't know if this is valid or just works for me against a raven I occasionally have casuals with but at full screen lex wins the zoning battle against her doesn't he? Her only option outside trait is that high projectile and lexs probes pin her down so that he can trait up then back dash cancel it and carry on zoning her with trait active.

Name v.5.0 said:

I've never played a Lex mirror match and I really want to. Any Lex's on PSN?

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I'm an eu player(England) add me for lex mirrors if you want: DreadKnight1

Thead said:

You can jump over the Bolas. If you're full screen, as soon as you hear that distinctive blip of Bola startup, you can wait for her to release and easily jump. Bolas have a lot of recovery on whiff, and a pretty long startup. Mid screen jump into Corp Charge punishes whiffed Bola, and can even stuff the startup of Bola if they leave it too long (deceptively long startup, the Bola can still be stuffed as its leaving Batgirls hand).

The trouble I had was vs Batgirls Cartwheel multi hitting wakeup, with Trait I could sometimes stuff it between the 1st and 2nd hits. Neutral jumping it I still seemed to get me. Is there a sure fire way to stop this wakeup other than standing back and letting it whiff?

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I deal with batgirls cartwheel in these 3 ways-

1.if I'm traited up id block the first 2 hits then stop blocking to let trait eat the third hit and get a clean 112 punish
2. Push block setup- I use this one as many others don't work on cartwheel cause she advances quite far. B3 dd3 then push block it
3. Bait it with mine then MB b3 them. This works off some setups every time as you hit them before they beat your armour. For example after b3 ji2 11dd3 (do the b3 ASAP)MBb3(they wakeup) and get beaten. Hope this helped